Paul Kingsnorth responds to Mark Perryman's call in Breaking up Britain for a progressive English identity.
‘What is Englishness?' is a question I have always studiously avoided answering. I can't stand the kind of lists that are sometimes drawn up by people trying to define ‘our national character', which always seem to come down to either a list of things that an English person should feel an attachment to (real ale, the countryside, David Beckham) or a list of Brownite-style ‘values' (tolerance, democracy, love of queuing) to which all English people should apparently feel equally committed.
But having read Mark's chapter, ‘a Jigsaw state', I am left with the feeling that perhaps we need to start trying to answer the question after all. Whether or not Britain ‘breaks up' in the political sense - and I am less convinced that it will ‘inevitably' do so than Mark seems to be - it is clearly already breaking up in the cultural sense. Scotland and Wales today feel more Scottish and Welsh than they did ten years ago, and so it seems do their people. The English, meanwhile, still struggling out from under ‘greater England', as Mark correctly calls the modern British identity, are in something of a fix. Still confused about the difference between Britishness and Englishness, always reluctant in any case to explain and define themselves, changed by immigration and the resulting policy of ‘multiculturalism', the English seem confused.
If, next month, some of that confusion, and frustration, translates into votes for BNP MEPs at the European elections, England will have something of a crisis on its hands. As Mark points out here, this would make the BNP the most successful far right party in our history - more successful in electoral terms than either Mosley's blackshirts or the National Front, they will be on the verge of becoming a ‘respectable' political party (forgive the oxymoron).
The BNP are, despite their name and their union flag logo, largely an English party, simply because the force which provides them with the most support - immigration and ethnic tensions and divisions - is largely confined to England. Any victory will be represented by them as a victory for ‘the English' against the combined forces of foreigners, non-white Britons, the cosmopolitan elite, Europe and maybe even globalisation. England, they will tell us, is rising from its slumber.
In this context, and if we are going to be able to contest their version of events, we will all need to start thinking hard about what ‘England' actually is. Mark makes a stab at doing so in this chapter, but I am left with more questions than answers. After rightly saying that ‘it's no longer sufficient to "reclaim" the St George Cross flag; in a disunited Kingdom it has to mean something too', he goes on to try and explore what that meaning might be, but he stalls. Perhaps because he, too, doesn't like prescriptive lists but also, it seems to me, because he is trying to fit the internationalist politics of the left into the nationalist politics to which he also feels a commitment. Thus we end up with a recipe which is something of a liberal cliche: ‘We need to construct a framework which celebrates diversity as a core value of social solidarity.' I'm not quite sure what this means, but however worthy it might be as a goal, there doesn't seem to be anything specifically ‘English' about it.
Perhaps what needs to be done here is to take a step back. Mark, myself and a growing number of other people feel that our ‘English' identity matters. But why? Why does it matter more than, say, our Britishness - or, come to that, our common humanity? If there is an answer to this it surely lies in our attachment to at least some aspects of the culture in which we have grown up and which is consequently embedded in us - a culture which we clearly regard as sufficiently different to, say, Scottish, British or global culture to be worth defining or even fighting for in some way.
In other words, Englishness is our cultural identity. To say that Englishness is a culture is effectively the same thing as saying that England is a nation - a word that Mark uses several times in this chapter. And a nation is not simply a piece of land, a political construct or even a random collection of people dwelling in the same place. A nation is a people who feel they are bound together by a culture, a history, a language, a homeland (in most cases) - in other words, a shared sense of self.
Mark sees England as a nation and he sees himself as part of that nation. So do I. But in this case, the cultural identity of that nation has to be about more than simply ‘celebrating diversity'. England is indeed - always has been - a very diverse nation. The nature of that diversity has changed over time, but the fact of it hasn't. Nevertheless, Englishness is - must be - still a recognisable cultural identity, or none of us would be writing about it.
And here perhaps is where liberal-left values come up uneasily against the celebration or promotion of Englishness. If Englishness is a cultural identity we have to concede two things. One, that it cannot in itself be ‘multicultural'. We might say that England is a multicultural country, or that Britain is a multicultural state, or that we would like them to be; but we cannot say that Englishness itself is multicultural, because a culture, by definition, cannot be.
Secondly, English identity must be by its nature exclusive, simply because all identities are. If you identity yourself as one thing you cannot be something else. For some time we have tried to sidestep this by talking about our ‘multiple identities' as individuals, and while there is truth in this observation, it will only take us so far. Englishness, like any other cultural identity, must necessarily be defined by what it isn't as much as what it is.
And here, of course, we can get very swiftly onto dangerous ground. The BNP brand of Englishness is an ethnic nationalism, which sees only ethnically ‘pure' English people as ‘truly' English. As well as being culturally and historically specious, this is obviously also extremely pernicious. It may also, in a time of economic crisis, be tempting for more and more people. It is imperative that those of is who would like Englishness to be a binding agent and a welcoming identity have something to say to counter this line; talk of ‘celebrating diversity' will simply not cut it, not least because it reeks of the kind of ‘multicultural political correctness' that the BNP rails against, with increasingly open support from the disenfranchised margins of the English nation.
Mark's answer to this - and mine - is a brand of English civic nationalism, which sees Englishness not as a racial or ethnic identity (though there is what we might call an English ‘ethnic group', which still dominates England and to which Mark and I both belong, it does not have sole claim over Englishness as a wider identity) but something which is open to those who wish to be part of it. Where perhaps we differ is that I think this nationalism has to be more openly and self-consciously English, in a cultural sense.
What do I mean by this? What I don't mean is that in order to ‘be English' you have to enjoy, say, Morris dancing, country walks and Inspector Morse; though you might do, of course. What I mean, I think, is three things.
Firstly, Englishness must surely involve a commitment and a sense of belonging to a place. I have written about this extensively in my book Real England; in summary, a sense of belonging to your dwelling place, the place where you live and were perhaps born, draws you into the English community, both in its present form and through the history of that place, whether it be an inner city or a rural village. By being in England, you become English.
Secondly, because this is not enough in itself - it is quite possible to be in England and not be remotely English or want to be - I think the key ingredient is a desire to belong. It is not enough simply to be in England; you need to want to be of it. You can have this desire whether you are descended from Ulfric the Saxon or from parents who arrived in the country last year to make it their new home. It is harder, of course, for new arrivals, and it is the duty of the English to make them welcome; but to make them welcome not to some formless, meaningless ‘British' or ‘multicultural' airport lounge, but to an England which has a long history, a real identity and a desire to see that identity develop with the times as it always has done (if Englishness were not a deeply flexible and mutable thing we would not still be talking about it a thousand years after it emerged as a national identity). It means, in short, seeing yourself as part of a historic nation, with specific cultural markers and traits, with a specific sense of itself and of its place in the world.
Lastly, as Mark correctly points out in his chapter, both of these things need to be openly attached to a clear anti-racist politics. Englishness, in my view can belong to those who choose to claim it as their own. If this is your home and you consider yourself to be English then you are, as far as I'm concerned, English. Full stop. This who would seek to divide us along racial or ethnic lines need to be firmly and loudly resisted. ‘England for the English', under these circumstances, should perhaps be co-opted by those of us to whom the BNP's vision of our nation is a repulsive step backwards.
Paul Kingsnorth is the author of Real England: the battle against the bland (Portobello Books.)




Comments
English is an ethnic identity.
A Japanese man who moves to England and becomes a British citizen doesn't suddenly experience a change in his genetics. His ethnicity remains Japanese.
You have a great nerve to deny the English their identity. I doubt you would do the same for anybody else.
English is indeed an ethnic identity!!!
Anthropologists who were originally really into scientifically categorising people into seperate racial groups ended up agreeing that actually they weren’t really being scientific by just making up categories.
Over long periods of time people who have lived in different climates and environments gradually pass on useful physical adaptations to those environments (genes) to their kids. So we get physical differences like skin colour, body shape, dietry patterns and all that kind of thing, but that’s about as far as it goes really.
Chucking out the concept of Race (biologically distinct subdivisions of the human species) as unscientific led anthropologists to start touting the concept of ‘ethnicity’ which is basically about all the non biological stuff like cultural ways of doing things. Unfortunately the term ‘ethnic group’ is now colloquially used simply to mean ‘racial group’ and so inadvertantly implies that there are indeed biologically distinct subdivisions of the human species (which we now simply have a prettier word for).
Some (understandably) take avoidance of the ‘race’ concept as namby pamby side stepping or wishy washy lefty political correctness (and no doubt it often is), but actually there are hard working physical and biological anthropologists who spend their lives studying human biological diversity for a living. From the scientific viewpoint of the profession, race (ie. the notion that there are biologically distinct subdivisions within the human species) is a myth.
So we would be misled to treat ethnic categories as politically neutral scientific descriptions of human groups. They are inherently political. The promotion of diverse identities within English ethnicity is both desirable and appropriate in a post devolution UK. In fact I would go so far as to argue that it amounts to instituional racism (I’ll use that term for all its political milage) to tacitly exclude non-white people from English ethnicity.
At any moment English ethnicity means what we make it mean. It seems good to look at our history, culture and traditions in order to move forward. How do you know where you’re going if you don’t look back?
To the previous poster,
Of course English is an ethnic identity, as is clearly stated by the author. However it's also a civic identity. If your hypothetical Japanese man were to have kids born and brought up in England they would be English in the eyes of most people in this country.
Paul, I like the emphasis on 'culture' as the ground of national identity, which is very much my own. In one sense, isn't it as simple as preferring 'environment' over 'race', or 'nurture' over 'nature', as the principal agent for creating national 'identity', which - by virtue of the use of that very term - is a psychological, personal and existential thing, in the first instance, rather than racial and genetic.
I do, however, think we need to be clear about the limits of culture as something that defines a 'civic Englishness' or a 'right to call oneself English'. Though I disagree with the opinion of the previous anonymous commenter, (s)he does have a valid point if you define national / ethnic identity in cultural rather than racial terms: a Japanese person who has lived in England for only a few years (enough time to acquire British citizenship, for instance) cannot in fact be <i>as</i> English, in the <i>cultural</i> sense, as someone born and brought up in England, of whatever ethnic background - no matter how deep or sincere an attachment that person might have to 'English culture'.
In other words, a cultural nationalism can become, in your own terms, an exclusive and, I would add, <i>excluding</i> nationalism, almost to the same extent as ethnic nationalism. And, indeed, the very terms 'cultural' and 'ethnic' overlap ambiguously. I think you are aware of this danger, as - after pinning your sails to the mast of culture - you slip into defining Englishness in terms of wanting to belong to a place and its culture, as much as actually belonging. However, this steers you into civic-nationalist territory and could make you vulnerable to the BNP charge of making England and Englishness available to all comers: 'anyone can come here and claim England / Englishness for their own'.
I think the BNP are cultural nationalists without realising it; except they see the determinants of cultural and personal characteristics as being racial / genetic more than social-environmental. So I would say it's by reclaiming the latter space as a ground of <i>inclusive</i> Englishness that we can best counter the racial-nationalists' exclusive definition of Englishness. This involves not just the civic idea that 'I have a right to live in this country and this culture because I choose it'; but 'I am (as you say) <i>of</i> this country because its culture lives <i>in me</i>'. In this sense, someone chooses to be English not just because they want to belong but because they already do belong: they are choosing to be (and to own) what they already are.
And so the counter-BNP slogan could be: 'you can take us out of England, but you can't take England out of us'.
Like everyone else, the English have ethnic/cultural identity, whether they like it or not (so to speak) (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Watching-English-Hidden-Rules-Behaviour/dp/0340818867). I don't therefore lose much sleep myself over the issue, but a lot of people seem to. What I would say to them is this.
What translates identity into nationality is usually a process of more or less deliberate "nation-building" which seems to work best in a context of successful resistance to external domination - as in Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Finland, (ultimately) Germany and Italy, Turkey, and so forth. Those with empires face the opposite problem of a weakening of their own sense of cultural and ethnic specificity as "our values" come to be seen as a universal standard which simply transcends culture. The tribe becomes a bit less tribal if it becomes the governing caste of an empire. The US tried to solve this problem by (a) seeking to dissociate political and ethnic identity by defining US citizenship in terms of loyalty to a written constitution and (b) seeking to create at least the impression not having an empire at all in the traditional sense of that term. The conservative Brits/Limeys did neither, with the result that there is a much more obviously blurred and overlapping relationship between the ethnic and cultural identity of the English national tribe, and the cosmopolitan claims of the imperial British ruling caste. I for one can't quite see the dividing line between the two, but they are in many subtle ways not quite the same group of people.
The messy overlap between Englishness and Britishness is an ongoing hangover from an early stage of this process. The past and present relationships of the English to the Empire/colonies/Commonwealth are a later symptom.
In my view, if the English want a positive, uncontested sense of cultural identity, what they need to do is just ditch any hint of this imperial baggage, and if this were to be done responsibly it would probably involve apologising for things like the empire and the slave trade, a move which would go along with practical steps like getting rid of the nukes, resolving issues like Diego Garcia, recasting any "special relationship" with the US, and so forth.
It's funny how those preoccupied with Englishness never seem to mention the empire much (unless I've missed it) and I think this silence speaks volumes. Decolonisation wasn't that long ago. It's more recent than the Blitz, and massively more recent than the Somme (ditto). I suspect that thinkers on the right, who punt a positive view of the imperial past in an attempt to flout something called "political correctness" and shore up a flagging sense of national self-esteem (http://www.civitas.org.uk/islandstory/), are shooting themselves in the foot even in their own terms. When Civitas republish "Our Island Story," they are actually making it harder to achieve a clear, positive sense of English identity, with the likely result is that opinion will tend to remain polarised towards the mutually sustaining extremes of left-liberal PC anti-nationalism and the BNP, and no positive sense of English cultural identity will emerge.
In a nutshell, the empire is the elephant in the room. The English could probably achieve a sense of unproblematic English cultural identity quite easily, but paradoxically it would involve getting off our high horse in a way the average Alf Garnett-level patriot would currently find counterintuitive to the point of impossibility.
People who are 'preoccupied by Englishness' as you call don't mention the empire much because they are sick of people like you bashing them and their nation (and only THEIR nation) only over the head with it.
It's a blatant and hypocritical attempt to keep the English in their place. Naturally everyone else's national identity is hunky dory but if you're promote English identity you're a narrow minded bigot who longs for the old days of Empire even though you are so unreasonable as to never actual mention the Empire at all. Typical dammed if you do, dammed if you don't twaddle.
The English could probably achieve a sense of unproblematic English cultural identity quite easily if nobody took any notice of people like you.
Sarah "People who are 'preoccupied by Englishness' as you call don't mention the empire much because they are sick of people like you bashing them and their nation (and only THEIR nation) only over the head with it." Not at all. Firstly, I'm not bashing the English (or not much), just making an observation. Secondly, I'm not JUST talking about the English. It's a general pattern. Anyone with an empire has probably been up against something similar at some point, including the Americans, French, Russians, Romans, and probably Persians and Babylonians. And toxic nationalism is hardly an English monopoly."Naturally everyone else's national identity is hunky dory but if you're promote English identity you're a narrow minded bigot who longs for the old days of Empire" I didn't say there was anything right or wrong with promoting the identity of the English or anyone else. In fact I'm all for it in general terms. I was just saying that, if promoting English identity is the objective, nostalgia for the empire seems to make it harder.
Great article Paul Kingsnorth.
But, I may agree in some sense, but not everything.
I'm British, and I'm Scottish... I can be both, because I choose to, and by birth. The people's of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland are united under our British Identity. This is how I see it, and always will, just as my forefathers before had.
When England, Wales or Northern Ireland are under threat, I will choose to help, and defend. Plus, If the peoples of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland wish to forget their History, or somehow "justify" disregarding it, then I believe they are no longer entitled to embrace such history as their own. Sorry, but that's how I see it.
Civic Nationalism - I don't know. Why? because the SNP are, and by this, fooling many pro-Scots. We are intrusted to protect our identity, our heritage. However, we're all throwing it away. I don't believe in "Multiculturalism", I never will. Because, If people from anywhere in the world want to come and live in the UK, they should respect our way of life. But, Islam, for example. It's changing our landscape, on all forms. Church's being converted into Mosques all over the UK, and in Europe. Sharia courts, foreign Imams (that don't repect British values) and many other things, next stop... Sharia Law, and it'll be British law integrating with Sharia. I'm sorry... Civic nationalists, have shown me their true colours, they are no different than the anti-British government we have now.
Well... the article is written well, and I liked it. Although, I wont agree with all of it, mainly because people are now categorising people like myself as extremists or fascists, yet we only want to protect what we've all inherited. And, if having a foreign ideology such as Islam replace it, and try and give it a new title, such as; British Islam... It wont work.
Civic nationalists are no different than the liberal government we have already which is now trying to make Britain a province of the EU, and the people of Britain a European Identity under the EU flag.
sorry if i've not written this very well and offended anyone.
I fail to understand all this angst. England IS a nation and has an identity. Always has had. So what is so right about Scottish Nationalism and so wrong about English Nationalism ? England was a nation state before Scotland and before Wales too. The nub of all this is why does Scotland and Wales deserve a say in their own affairs and England does not ? All to do with Labour's Scottish Raj.
I come from one of the ethnic groups in Britain that is not acknowledged by English people in general, though we are acknowledged in other European countries - the Cornish. I would like to contribute to the debate on Englishness as I have observed the English way of life at first hand throughout my whole life with increasing concern.
I believe that many commentators have missed the main point of what binds us together. It is not what we do - the tea drinking, etc or our values - tolerance, etc, though these are currently national characteristics. It is what we feel - the warmth, love, sense of belonging and oneness with others who are part of the same culture. And belonging to such a group usually depends on loving (yes - loving) the land and the stories of the people who have lived there through the centuries.
Unfortunately to admit to being Cornish often brings denigrating and cutting comments from English people. But I need to explain that I love Cornwall, the Cornish culture and being Cornish. I wish the English could share this love of their land and each other, to rejoice in the shared stories of their past and to be proud of where they are in the present and confident that they can work together (emphasis together) to build a better future.
Unfortunately I see instead an English society that has shrunk in on itself. On many new estates everyone keeps themselves to themselves - each is a stranger in their own non-community. If we do not even trust our neighbours, how can we develop a heart-warming, empowering culture? Blame television, less friendships formed at church, long working hours, many other things, but if we don't have time for each other, and we don't share our stories and love each other for them, we do not have a sustaining culture. I almost long for the days when each neighbour used to compete to have the biggest car - at least they were interested in what you had in the drive!
Modern England seriously lacks ways of bringing people together into communities. Most people don't believe in religion, so belonging to a church, chapel etc. is out. Far fewer people belong to a union and serve others as shop stewarts and so on. The thousands of men and women who belonged to large factories and mines which were communities in themselves have been replaced by machines. The modern English person does not belong to anything larger than their immediate family. This lack of belonging characterises modern Englishness. The English have been characterised as cold and reserved in the past, but the modern way of English life goes beyond that and could be described as soul-less.
But as I come from a somewhat closer ethnic culture, perhaps I don't understand. Are the English happy this way? Should new immigrants be taught that fortunately England is somewhere that you don't have to belong? I personally think that England needs to rediscover community life (though in a reserved English way of course!) in order to retrieve its soul.
Hey Paul - you don't seem to have read Boris's efforts, he says that the defining thing about being English is.... English. By making the language defining he also makes 'the' culture multicultural. So he seems to be ahead of you on this, as it clearly is! See:
http://www.opendemocracy.net/blog/ourkingdom-theme/anthony-barnett/2009/04/19/st-boris-of-england
PS: It simply isn't the case that "if you identify yourself as one thing you can't be something else". Unless, that is, you define "one" as being strictly exclusive in which case it is a tautology not an observation.
I feel that you have raised a very important point Paul. I would like to try to take this forward using Scotland as an example.
It is a mistake to think that Scottish national identity is primarily based on culture. The cultural differences within Scotland are historically greater than those within England. The ‘Gaelic’ speaking culture of North West Scotland is as different to the ‘Scots’ speaking culture of the rest of Scotland, as exemplified, say, by the poetry of Burns, as English culture is to Irish. Yet what has happened over time is that things previously associated with this Gealic culture have been gradually adopted by those other Scots in order to provide stronger outward cultural markers. The most widespread example of this being the practice of wearing kilts at weddings [which has gradually spread over the last twenty years]. In doing this Scots as a whole are adopting world-wide recognised symbols of Scotland to display their allegiance to an identity which is not itself based on any one culture.
What underlies this desire to display outwardly an inner national identity is a desire to articulate shared experience and place in the world. But that shared experience is primarily based on the continuing existence of Scottish society articulated by the continuation in various modes over the centuries of the Scottish State. This is what marks allegiance to Scotland off from allegiance to Yorkshire, for instance. The Scottish State survived the Union of 1707 in the shape of continuing exclusive Scottish State institutions such as a national church, legal system etc and later in new forms such as national sporting associations. New life was breathed into it at the end of the 19th century with the establishment of the Scottish Office. The growth of Scottish Nationalism as we know it today closely mirrors the growing re-emergence of distinctive Scottish State institutions.
The problem in England is that that same process works against the emergence of a civic English nationalism because the state is a British/English State. The confusion at the level of the state colours peoples shared experience. You may say isn’t the Scottish State a British/Scottish State, and here it gets interesting because the political imperative, especially since the discovery of North Sea oil, even before devolution, has been to accentuate the exclusively Scottish nature of state institutions in Scotland. This has been mirrored even by quasi state institutions like the BBC.
The implications of this is that the emergence of a more distinctly English State may need to be the precursor of the emergence of a strong English civic nationalism rather than a product of that nationalism. In the light of this the upcoming Conservative Government’s plans for dealing with the democratic deficit created by devolution take on an extra significance. Making departments of state that deal with English only matters such as the Departments of Health, Transport, Communities and Local Government etc. explicitly English departments, for instance, will shape people’s experience, just as this sort of thing did in Scotland. The creation of a Grand Committee of English MPs, will likewise accentuate this process, which is why it won’t happen if there isn’t enough pressure applied.
This understanding of the nature of civic nationalism reveals why it is naturally inclusive rather than exclusive unlike ethnic nationalism. If everyone who lives in a territory is acculturated simply by the shared experience of living in the territory then there is no need to demarcate who belongs and who doesn’t. Recent research, for instance, suggests Muslims identify more strongly with their adopted country than other groups. But, in the case of England, what they identify with is problematic because of the confusion of Britain and England.
Paul and myself agree on much.However I remain unconvinced by this necessity for definition. Neither Scottish nor Welsh nationalism is founded on such a desire to define, why should we in England? A civic nationalism is based on a sense of place. When Scotland breaks away and Wales deepens its separation too then the Union is no more and England will be stripped bare. Of course in the meantime there will be a growing sense of what England is, but this is process, a contest, there is no single version, nor should there be. Indeed that is why I would disagree with Paul's notion that a national identity has to be exclusive, and a whole section of the book deals with English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish experiences of how nationalism can form barriers of exclusion and how these can be broken down too. Mark
I was born in England but am a product of Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and England.
My identity is British, My cultural identity comes from those who influenced me, my parents friends family and education, artists etc...... which in all honesty is a mish mash of differing cultures.
Culture is an evolving creature
You can look back in time and see the different periods and trends that developed our national culture today.
Today our National culture is a British one.
If you need to define the English culture then you will have to look back in time define the Great English periods and also add on those English people, artists, ideas that exist today. Which would be very hard as I think you will find that the British influence dominates.
Kind regards Micheal
Thanks for comments, all.
Mark - actually I think the Scots and Welsh have spent a lot of time thinking about what their cultures are and aren't. In Wales you'll be taught about it in school (or go along to an Eisteddfodd ...) Again, mutable, ever-changing, etc, but with some obvious sense of a fairly timeless centre. Place is a big part of this, but not enough in itself.As for exclusion - I repeat my point that any identity, by its very definition, is exclusive. It excludes those who don;t identify with it. This is both a semantic and a logical point which you can't get away from. The challenge is to make an identity welcoming and open-hearted, not to pretend it isn't an identity.
Anthony - fun piece by Boris, but since half the world is defined by the English language it's going to take more than that. And agin, I think here that 'multicultural' is just chucked out as a kind of token warm word without it being thought through. As I say, by definition a culture cannot be multicultural; not least because the word 'multicultural' makes no sense if you don't accept the existence of discrete cultures. England can be multicultural, but Englishness can't. That's not the same thing as saying it can't change and isn't made up of influences from all over the world. But if you think it's worth defining as a culture (and some people don't) you have to stop hedging your bets!
Conrishman - I think you have hit the nail on the head in many ways. The current lack of community in England connects directly to our lack of a sense of self and place; something which I would like to rediscover.
Sarah2 - I suggest you read the article again, carefully, with knee kept still.
Britologywatch - thanks, very interesting thoughts, and a good refinement of what I was trying to say.
Sarah2 - an apology, because I have just realised you were responding to someone else and not to me.
Alex Buchan - I should have said before that I found your post fascinating. I agree that an English polity would help define Englishness more than anything else. This is another area where I disagree with Mark and, for example, Billy Bragg. I think an English political structure is vital for an identity to develop, because it will help it develop. If we don't have institutions through which we can speak as a nation it is much harder for us to be a nation. Regional assemblies are not going to speak for England - they are answering another question entirely. And though I agree with Mark that, for example, it would be nice to have a St George's bank holiday and a national anthem, I think these are less urgent matters than defining ourselves politically as the Scottish and Welsh have done. Thanks for your thoughts on that, which are more coherent than mine.
I agree with our Cornish supporter. Devon, like Cornwall and Somerset, is also a county in England!
And just as there are people of Cornish ethnicity in Devon, there are people of Polish ethnicity in Cornwall.
Would a Polish person who calls Cornwall their home ever be accepted as 'Cornish'?
Of Course they would! - it is making the county ones home that counts!
In the same way, it is of course also possible for that same person to be English - to be part of England, our nation as a whole!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2006/oct/16/heritage.britishidentity
When England, Wales or Northern Ireland are under threat, I will choose to help, and defend.
English is an ethnic identity.
Absolutely, completely agree
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