Thank you! This is very nice of you! i also look forward to learning from you! This time with more peaceful debating!

Joeanne Nee, The hatred of America by the 9/11 hi-jackers can be traced to the US interference in the Middle East and the support it gives to Israel and the undemocratic regimes of Saudi Arabi, Kuwait and Egypt amongst others. The US supported the destabilization and overthrow of the democratically elected Iranian President Dr Mossadeq in the early 1950's, as has been stated on this thread many times, as you are aware. The US supported Saddam Hussein's murderous war with Iran, because of its policy of not allowing any nation to threaten the oil supply and Iran was reckoned to be moving in the direction of becoming the Gulf principal power. Hundreds of thousands of Iranian and Iraqi youth were killed and wounded in this long war of attrition, wich the US did nothing to stop. In fact the contrary was the case.Donald Rumsfled's Pentagon and CIA supplied intelligence to Saddam with regard to Iranian militry positions so that the Iraqi army could better direct their chemical weapons. Israel possesses nuclear weapons that the US never speaks about, yet warns Iran not to join the nuclear club. Such bias and hypocrisy is obvious to the entire Muslim population of the world, let alone the Middle East. In the face of all that I have mentioned, is it a surprise that the US is hated by so many Muslims but what is even more suprprising is that the revenge they seek for what they feel is unabated aggression against them, has not gone much further in terms of terrorist activity outside of Iraq. Now I know that the US and Europe and now China depend on Middle East oil and that no one has clean hands in this situation, however, the Muslims and their activists tend to look at the main despoiler, which is the US. The tragedy, as you have pointed out, is that the entire world's economy is absolutley dependent on oil and there is so much financial interest by big oil Corporations that support the Republican neocon Bush administration, that the alternative energy you speak of as the way of release from this quagmire, is looking a very long way off. The most likely future outcome is more wars leading eventually to the big bang you mentioned in your last post. We are all caught up in a world where there are so many cross currents of interests and conflicts, that a move in one direction causes a problem in another, or to put it in proverbail terms, one man's meat is another man's poison. It has always been so and it will continue to be so. Message was edited by: brolly3 Message was edited by: brolly3 Message was edited by: brolly3

OH MY! Where to start? ok Brollly, I am well aware of alot of the wheelin and dealin that has been done over the decades. I also would say that our government wasnt the only ones who had their hands stuck in some of those black ops. My post was a sarcastic(not in a mean sense)reply to say wake up. There were alot of countries throughout 80's that also asked for our help, which we did. Am I saying that we are Polly Purebreads, no-that would take a frontal labotomy for that thought, but do I believe we are this huge evil group- ABSOLUTELY NOT. England had a way of enforcing it's system of government on alot of countries "The Brithish Empire". Should those countries hate all english? no. Are we a bigger target, oh yeah. Alot of it, has been this on going mix with the israelis and the palestinian, who fight over whos chunk of dirt it is. OH, and yes I know it is Holy to them.(no disrespect intended) At some point, and in most religiona one is taught that to be forgiven one must be able to forgive. Unfortunately, sometimes I think that there are to many layers and subsects of interconnected back door deals with all the countries. Done before my moms conception, that to try to accurately say who has done what and why would be an act of utter futility. We have never really had journalistic "integrity"- I believe that there are some journalist who believe in the truth, but again there is another web of policies and well... the hoops you have to jump through. Sorry, Brolly Im having a hard time saying just simply- That we shouldnt be so suprised, but yet we were. We have become these mindless sheep so focused on how we are going to get that better job, or is my company going to move out of the country, that we werent watching the people we elected to look out for our best interests and not their banks interests. There alot of people on a one to one basis might be happy, but like any oppressed person whos been tortured you would hug a cactus if they were the ones walkin into your country with tanks, guns and hi tech weapons. If they are that fanatical, then they truly will not think twice about blowing a dirty nuke, and feel that it is the right thing to do. So, in my one small way wanted just to show people, that if pupri and I found a way to make a bridge-(look at some of the other topics to see what this is about) souldnt we all start to try to understand other cultures and teach them that we are all not like people who made these deals back then. That we as individuals should try to bridge these gaps. Oh Geez, I could go on and on about things, but my whole point was that it can be done if we stop for a minute and realize that we as a people need to be more responsible about the bridges built between our peoples and not mindlessly expect our government is doing it. I dont relish the thought of learning how to say BBBBAAAAAAHHH, will grazing in the field. TTrryosborn, I am sure that there are alot of Iraqis that might be happy that we are fixin the mess thats been made in there country. Sure they might be happy that Saddam wont be killing them just for the kick of it. But we had no reason to go into their country in the first place. We are the ones that got caught with our pants down in our own complacancy, while our fbi and cia were asleep at the wheel because they dont play together well. We retaliated to Afghanistan appropriately. At that point we should have started working on what went wrong here and fixed that, now just said "hell the jets and bombers are all fired up, why not take 'em for a spin around the block" WE as a people need to look at what we need to do to shore up our defences and start repairing some fences that need mending. The old addage "good fences make good neighbors" That was my point. If just two women from two different cultures and possibley two different beliefs(i didnt directly ask her about her religion) can try to smooth rough waters between us so that we can learn from one another, that empowers us by knowledge. I refuse to be a sheep, besides wool makes me itchy. Hopefully I clarified what my point was and if I didnt, Ill make sure I have the bandaids ready for my ass-shredding. Joeanna