open Democracy News Analysis - Islamophobia, - Comments

adrianabublles on "Islamophobia"

adrianabublles — Tue, 05 Jul 2005 19:08:24 +0100

OWLY said: "how can a gay man following the path the Lord who has himself mapped out for him be a sinner?" (Sigh)…alright owly, some points here need to be addressed. First, you seem to be consistently confusing the simple concept: It’s not who are you are, it’s what you do. It’s the fundamental right of every human being to simply “be”, however human beings do not have the right to simply do as they wish for obvious reasons. Be it divine or other or what ever. To put it plain and simply you don’t need to keep harping on the same ‘dilemma’ about homosexually. If you are gay and need some type of solace, you are accepted for who you are. What disturbs people is that homosexuals, especially in Canada, seem to impose their philosophical baggage on others who don’t share the same values. Some homosexuals actually lobby to do away with the social need for the hetero/homo division. This implies the gay experience is the same as ours. I believe that gay marriages are different from hetero marriages, and should have a different status. It's time to recognize that homo and hetero sexuality are in fierce competition. There can only be one model. An important issue in the 21st Century is: will ours be a heterosexual society that tolerates a 4% gay minority or, will it be a homosexual society that dictates the norms of a 96% straight majority? The homosexual model does not fit heterosexuals. If straights don't establish the norms, gay activists will. When gay/feminist activist demand "equality," they are demanding that one model fit all. They are saying that we are the same and this is not appreciated. Now, please by as gay as you like and indulge in its practices as much as you need. Just keep us out of it please. Secondly, if you think the recent Western promotion of homosexuality is “advancement’ then take note that civilizations in the past have come and gone in waves. Look closely at the trends they had at the times when they were on their way out. What still stands however is that life preserving wisdom must prevail in a society or a given society may cease to exist. Whether you like it or not religion provides this life preserving wisdom. Finally, about the issue with God. If you believe God is the all mighty creator who forbids and accepts certain human behavior and will judge at the end of time, He has given us rules as life preserving wisdom to follow which separate us from the animals. If you do not believe that God has forbidden certain actions, or we are not accountable for our deeds or we are here as nothing more than animals, the premise that “its not who you are, it’s what you do” is of no consequence. Good luck with your journey.

stevencarrwork on "Islamophobia"

stevencarrwork — Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:44 +0000

One cause of Islamophobia is the Internet We can read Islamic web sites. http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/059.sbt.html Volume 5, Book 59, Number 369: Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah: Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Islamic web sites make clear that Muslims believe that Allah can be hurt, and that people should be killed for doing so.

David Thompson on "Islamophobia"

David Thompson — Sat, 29 Jan 2005 11:44:49 +0000

g-greg and Jeff, “Many people in Western societies do indeed have a problem with Islam. I recognise that this is driven by ignorance, prejudice and/or outright stupidity.” Conversely, that “problem with Islam” may be due to those who do “follow Islamic issues closely” having some knowledge of Islamic doctrine and how that doctrine is frequently manifested. The following thread, which discusses some of the specifics, might be of interest: http://www.opendemocracy.net/forums/thread.jspa?forumID=87&threadID=43474&start=700&tstart=0

Jeff Richards on "Islamophobia"

Jeff Richards — Sat, 29 Jan 2005 08:10:19 +0000

Oh, one other thing for those who are ready to blame Islam for the horrors of the modern world. Question:Which relegious community leaders were significant facilitators in the butchering of 800,000 men women and children in Rwanda? Answer: Christian community leaders. Question: Which relegious communities protected some of those responsible for the butchery in Rwanda? Answer: Catholic communities. Question: Which relegious community leaders resisted the communal butchery in Rwanda? Answer: Muslim relegious leaders.

Jeff Richards on "Islamophobia"

Jeff Richards — Sat, 29 Jan 2005 07:36:28 +0000

I have no reason to doubt the claim that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. As a committed secularist, I would prefer a world that recognised that God is and illusion of hope in a world with so much suffering and uncertainty. Sadly, it seems I am the one who is hoping. Many people in Western societies do indeed have a problem with Islam. I recognise that this is driven by ignorance, prejudice and/or outright stupidity. However, one of the paradoxes of Islam’s growth in the modern world is that it is a faith that is now in crises. Islam recognises has no earthly central authority. This is probably a good thing, but it poses some serious problems for a faith confronted by a modernity whose every facet is now the object of market relations. In my view the emergence of tendencies seeking to resolve issues with violence from within Islam is an indication of the crises within Islamic religious communities. We should remember that the greatest victims of violence in Islam are Muslims themselves (e.g. the targeting of the Shia by the Sunni in occupied Iraq). Many Islamic leaders in western societies seem incapable of finding new strategies to ‘keep their flock’ from the temptations of modernity and resort to fostering division to maintain control. While I do not follow Islamic issues very closely, I am encouraged by the evolution of some fundamentalist Islamic leaders, particularly in Iran, who recognise that Islam must reconcile its existence with secular cosmopolitan societies. We ought to recognise that Islams great gift to the west was the salvaging of the legacy of the ancient world when western Europe descended into the ‘dark ages’. Moreover, among the foundations of the thinking of the Enlightenment were ideas developed by Islamic scholars. We should never forget the great pioneer of modern historical thinking and modern sociology was no other than the tunisian born 14th century scholar Ibn Khaldun. http://www.muslimphilosophy.com/ei/KHALDUN.htm

Republican_X on "Islamophobia"

Republican_X — Tue, 11 Jan 2005 07:05:25 +0000

Just wanted to point out that Mr Ahmad failed to craft a response to my post. And I thought I might have had a Muslim Scholar to debate with?

owly on "Islamophobia"

owly — Fri, 03 Dec 2004 10:17:30 +0000

Strong stuff Republican_X. The trouble is its all true.

Republican_X on "Islamophobia"

Republican_X — Fri, 03 Dec 2004 06:20:12 +0000

Iftikhar, “The real reason for the current spate of Islamophobia is the fact that Islam has been the fastest growing religion in the world and as such poses a threat to the West. This is happening inspite of widespread misconceptions and negative media portrayed of Islam.” Or maybe it is happening because wherever muslims are trouble follows. Perhaps, the fact that all the terrorists are muslim has something to do with it too? “The defeat of Christians by the Muslims in Crusades was a big shock for the Christian world. These deep wounds are still so fresh in the Christian world today that the parents, media, politicians and teachers feel it a duty to nurture the feelings of prejudice against Islam in the hearts and minds of their young generations.” Do you really think you defeated the Christians? Since the Crusades where meant to be a distraction to the people of the Holy Roman Empire I really do not think victory by Christians where ever the object. The Christians gave up because they no longer needed the distraction. How do you come to the conclusion that prejudice is nurtured? Hatred of anybody is not taught is U.S. schools…not even Catholic ones. That is the domain of YOUR culture. This is well documented where as I seriously doubt you will be able to produce reports of Islam hating being taught in western schools. “According to Dr. Richard Stone, there is now renewed talk of a clash of civilizations, a new global cold war, and mounting concern that the already fragile foothold gained by Muslim communities in Britain is threatened by ignorance and intolerance.” A clash of civilizations is coming and it is your doing. Many of your ilk complain that you are being grouped with the terrorists just because you are muslim. Well here is a counter complaint…you do nothing to stop them from killing innocent people. You KNOW who these people are and yet you do nothing to internally police them. If you continue to allow them to kill innocent people you will soon find out how ruthless Americans can really be. Especially when we no longer hold at bay the fanatics in our midst. “Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of the sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myth that historians have ever repeated.” Oh…so it is a conspiracy theory spread over centuries by all the west’s historians to misrepresent the history of the muslims. What a revelation! “West is not based on Judeo-Christian civilization. This term should be abandoned to be replaced by Judeo-Christian-Islamic civilization.” Ahh yes it is. Unless you would like to show specific reference where Islam has not been anything but an intolerant pariah on western civilization? “Through out the modern history, Muslims have contributed for the Renaissance of Western culture and society… Islamic ideas helped shape the European West that produced the values cherished by the constitution’s framers.” What muslim played a major role in the Renaissance? NONE. Muslims destroyed much of what the west had learned when you burned Constantine’s library down when the muslims sacked Constantinople. The Constitutions framers barely knew the existence of islam when they wrote it. The framers took lessons learned in England and France and applied it to the Constitution. There is no influence by your philosophy that I can find in any history book I have access to. “Western culture is infact based on Muslim culture.” Well that is quite a miracle since western civilization pre dates islam. “The early Muslim knew this and they were instrumental in giving the west much of the scientific knowledge that has once helped it to thrive.” From an American standpoint this is just plain false. If I was living in colonial times and I wanted to be and Engineer I would have to first learn German because all the engineering texts where in German…not Arabic. “In America a great number of universities, colleges and schools are offering Islamic Studies courses. There is a possibility that in the near future half of native population would revert to Islam.” Yes this is true. Americans desperately want to avoid killing every single one of you. To do this we are trying to understand your culture so that we may find a way to co exist. This is a stark contrast from your madras that teaches children to hate and become suicide bombers. No one is misrepresenting you. Your people have fell to the waist side of modern western thought because you prevent people from learning without prejudice. You oppress and brain wash your women. You are lying to your selves’ everyday. Republican_X

David Thompson on "Islamophobia"

David Thompson — Wed, 01 Dec 2004 06:52:11 +0000

"There would be a lot less 'Islamophobia' around if there were less intransigent 'westernophobia' on display from so many Islamic commentators..." Amen to that. The thread linked below might be of interest: http://www.opendemocracy.net/forums/thread.jspa?forumID=87&threadID=43474&start=150&tstart=0

aqwe05 on "Islamophobia"

aqwe05 — Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:21:35 +0000

Truelight: from what I have read, your comments on the ethos and intent of Koranic teaching with respect to the position of women is fundamentally correct. However, the reality appears to be that while the teaching in the Koran may well give women comfort, the teachings of many in authority in Islamic societies does no such thing. There seems to be a gulf between the intent of Koranic writing and the actions of modern Islamic religious leaders. I rather doubt that the young lady who was waiting to be stoned to death under Sharia law in Nigeria because she was pregnant out of wedlock felt'comforted' by the practical realities of Islam today. There would be a lot less 'islamophobia' around if there were less intransigent 'westernophobia'/'reasonablenessophobia' on display from so many Islamic commentators... Message was edited by: aqwe05

truelight101 on "Islamophobia"

truelight101 — Thu, 25 Nov 2004 00:41:23 +0000

Dear Ade, Thank you for your comment. First of all in our religion we come prepared with proof of our words so as to not just speak from our whims and ill felt opinions. Slander and back biting (also considered backbiting if it is in their face)are sinfull and why you dont see us talking trash about "christians" (not the better of us anyway). You are entitled to your media pupet driven words but your views are onesided and not the least bit worldly or fair. Chose your words wisely if you do not want to come across as ignorant. You seem to be mis-informed (amongst other things) on the issue of our "prizon costumes". Just as our beloved Mary, mother of Jesus (may Allah be pleased with her)wore the "hijab" (hee-jab) we do so to honor ourselves and not to be seen in any way usefull to the nature of man to exploit us as you see plastered on every billboard and in very excedingly high statistic on abuses twards women in the U.S. and other "western" soccieties. You see your self as free but we see ourselves as even more free not being tied to what men want us to be so they can use us and deny us our rights, speak to us ufairly and make us pay the bills. No man could EVER make us wear it (hijab)if they are true Muslims. There is no compulsion in Islam as stated in Quran and no one can be forced to do or believe a thing. We (women)are seen as equal (not from mans rib) and have our own free will which decides our eternal abode. Believe it or not (and you probably will never know if you turn from my words to msnbc, cnn and fox)for most of muslim women in islam, Islam IS womens lib...unlike anything you have even known. Keep on with your easy/quick(shot) witted opinions you have formed from gossip and the media, maybe even misinformed ppl from your church but they (your words)are unfair, hatefull and misguided. If you are so aware of the broken structure of Christianity in America then you should also know that hate and lack of compassion are not of the true essence of Jesus (may Allah be pleased with him). Inform your self dear sister and you may find that the bubble you live in is going to some day self destruct. I would not judge you to be as evil as Bush and i expect that you dont judge us as you see us on the street to be as evil or ignorant as those who claim Islam to kill innocent people. Killing innocent people is never ok no matter who you are. Children are pure and considered muslims (ones who submit to the will of one God), would a child kill innocent people without the guidance of shayton(satan)? “…Whoever kills a person, not as a recompense for his killing of another, or to spread corruption on earth, then it is as if he has killed all of mankind…” [Holy Qur’aan: Chapter 5 Verse 32] May Allah (one God) forgive you (and me), you will be in my prayers. Allah hafiz,(God protect) Naimah/31 mother of 2, Swedish(white as snow most likely just like you) The Eminence Islam Attaches To Women by Harun Yahya The position of women in Islam has recently been an issue of debate. Some misconceptions arise, either from traditional practices which are thought to be "Islamic," but are not, or else from prejudices. However, the real issue is how women are regarded in the Islamic faith, and when we look at this, we see that Islam gives women great social value, freedom and comfort. Women in the Qur'an God's commandments about the status of women and the relations between men and women, which have been revealed to us through the Qur'an, consist of full justice. In this regard, Islam suggests equality of rights, responsibilities and duties between the two genders. Islam is based on sympathy, tolerance and respect for human beings, and does not discriminate against women in this matter. The examples of good morals communicated to us in the Qur'an are universally compatible with human nature, and are valid for all stages of history. Respect for women and women's rights fall within this. In the Qur'an God insists that the tasks and responsibilities of women are the same as those of men. Furthermore, while performing these tasks and responsibilities men and women must help and support each other: The men and women of the believers are friends of one another. They command what is right and forbid what is wrong, and establish prayer and pay alms, and obey Allah and His Messenger. They are the people on whom Allah will have mercy. Allah is Almighty, All Wise. (Qur'an, 9:71) God emphasizes that believers will be rewarded in the same manner according to their deeds, regardless of their gender. Their Lord responds to them: 'I will not let the deeds of any doer among you go to waste, male or female - you are both the same in that respect... (Qur'an, 3:195) Anyone who acts rightly, male or female, being a believer, We will give them a good life and We will recompense them according to the best of what they did. (Qur'an, 16:97) In another verse, Muslim men and women are considered together, and it is stressed that both have the same responsibility and status in God's sight: Men and women who are Muslims, men and women who are believers, men and women who are obedient, men and women who are truthful, men and women who are steadfast, men and women who are humble, men and women who give alms, men and women who fast, men and women who guard their private parts, men and women who remember Allah much: Allah has prepared forgiveness for them and an immense reward. (Qur'an, 33:35) In the Qur'an there are many more verses stating that men and women are exactly equal in terms of their tasks and responsibilities and their rewards or punishments in return. There are a few differences in social issues, but these are for the comfort and protection of women. The commands of the Qur'an regard the congenital differences between the two genders resulting from their creation, and suggest a system maintaining equal justice for men and women in this light. Islam does not see women as objects. Therefore, it is not seen appropriate that a woman of good morals should marry a man of bad morals. In the same way, it is not permitted for a woman of bad morals to marry a man of good morals: Corrupt women are for corrupt men and corrupt men are for corrupt women, Good women are for good men and good men are for good women. The latter are innocent of what they say. They will have forgiveness and generous provision. (Qur'an, 24:26) Also as regards marriage, the duties and responsibilities of couples towards each other require equality. God demands that both spouses be protective of and supervise each other. This duty is expressed in the Qur'an in the following words: They are covers for you and you for them... (Qur'an, 2:187) Many rules and commandments exist in the Qur'an regarding the protection of women's rights on marriage. Marriage is based on the free will of both parties; the husband has to provide economic support for his wife (4:4); the husband has to look after his ex-wife after divorce (65:6). The Islamic Emancipation of Women As the verses make clear, Islam brings justice to male-female relations and puts an end to harmful practices resulting from customs and traditions of pre-Islamic societies. One example is the situation of women in pre-Islamic Arab society. The pagan Arabs regarded women as inferior, and having a daughter was something to be ashamed of. Fathers of daughters sometimes preferred to bury them alive rather than announce their birth. By means of the Qur'an, Allah prohibited this evil tradition and warned that on the Judgment Day such people will definitely have to account for their actions. In fact, Islam brought with it a great emancipation for women, who were severely persecuted in the pagan era. Prof. Bernard Lewis, known as one of the greatest Western experts on the history of Islam and the Middle East, makes the following comment: In general, the advent of Islam brought an enormous improvement in the position of women in ancient Arabia, endowing them with property and some other rights, and giving them a measure of protection against ill treatment by their husbands or owners. The killing of female infants, sanctioned by custom in Pagan Arabia, was outlawed by Islam. But the position of women remained poor, and worsened when, in this as in so many other respects, the original message of Islam lost its impetus and was modified under the influence of pre-existing attitudes and customs. 1 Karen Armstrong, another Western expert on Islam, makes the following comment: We must remember what life had been like for women in the pre-Islamic period when female infanticide was the norm and when women had no rights at all. Like slaves, women were treated as an inferior species, who had no legal existence. In such a primitive world, what Muhammad achieved for women was extraordinary. The very idea that a woman could be witness or could inherit anything at all in her own right was astonishing. 2 In fact, during the many centuries that followed Prophet Muhammad, women of the Islamic societies had a much higher social position than the women of Christendom. Karen Armstrong emphasizes that, during the Middle Ages; ... the Muslims were horrified to see the way Western Christians treated their women in the Crusader states, and Christian scholars denounced Islam for giving too much power to menials like slaves and women. 3 Anna King, a modern Muslim woman and a convert - or, better to say, a revert - to Islam, explains the Islamic emancipation of women as follows: Islam first gave women their rights in a time when women were nothing but the property of men. Islam gave women the right to buy and sell on their own, own businesses and express her views politically. These were all basic rights which the American woman was not granted until relatively recently! It also encouraged women to study and learn Islamic knowledge, breaking a ban which several religions had stipulated, which forbid women to acquire any religious knowledge or touch religious texts... It also abolished the practice of marrying a woman without her consent. Thus, one would have to be very stubborn indeed to refuse such obvious facts and proofs that Islam was women's first liberator. The tendencies to see women as "an inferior species" who has no right for education and that must be totally secluded from the society arose much later in the Islamic world, as a result of deviations from the right Qur'anic path. Conclusion Thus we can say that the mentality that despises women, excludes them from society and regards them as second class citizens is a wicked pagan attitude which has no place in Islam. In fact, devout women are depicted as good examples for mankind in the Qur'an. One is Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ. Another is the wife of the Egyptian Pharaoh who, despite her husband's wickedness, is also described as an ideal Muslim. (see, 66:11-12) The Qur'an also describes very gentle conversations between the Prophet Solomon and the Queen of Sheba (27:42-44), and between Moses and two young ladies (28:23-26), which symbolize the civilized social relationship between the two genders. Therefore, it is impossible for a Muslim to have a bigoted approach to women. In a society where true Islamic morals are practiced, immense respect and sympathy will be shown to women, and it will be ensured that they can live in freedom and comfort. The fundamental rule in Qur'anic exegesis is ensuring that the derived meaning is in conformity with the integrity of the Qur'an. When this is considered, it is seen that all the rules mentioned to us by Allah regarding women form a social structure allowing them to live in the most comfortable and happiest way. In a society where all the moral values mentioned by Islam are practiced comprehensively, the social position of women becomes even more exalted than in societies that we today regard as modern.

ade.clegg on "Islamophobia"

ade.clegg — Fri, 27 Aug 2004 07:38:49 +0100

Dear Mr Ahmad. I am no expert on Islam, but as a follower of the Lord Jesus I recognise legalism wherever I see it. Religion = Legalism = The Devil. The Jews are still in bondage under the Law. Islamics are under their own version of the law. Ironically, you as a group of people have much in common with the Jews. They with their Sabbath keeping and food laws, and you with your food laws and regulated prayer times. You even parade your women in a form of prison uniform. As far as Christianity is concerned, do not be fooled by the mainstream churches as, in the main, they do not represent Jesus Christ, especially Rome or any church that seeks unity with it. See my post on religion. As for Islamophobia, those in the west i.e. the secular majority, have every good reason to be wary and vigilant as to what you people are up to.

Islamophobia,

info_28 — Sat, 07 Aug 2004 17:29:14 +0100

Established 1981 London School of Islamics An Educational Trust 63 Margery Park Road London E7 9LD Email: info@londonschoolofislamics.org.uk www.londonschoolofislamics.org.uk Tel/Fax: 0208 555 2733 / 07817 112 667 Islamophobia Islamophobia and Arabophobia has been part of western culture since the Crusades, with Saddam and Osama only the latest in a long line of Arab bogeymen. The real reason for the current spate of Islamophobia is the fact that Islam has been the fastest growing religion in the world and as such poses a threat to the West. This is happening inspite of widespread misconceptions and negative media portrayed of Islam. Read the rest of this post...