Kanishk Tharoor on "America's pious song and dance"

Kanishk Tharoor — Wed, 21 May 2008 12:27:22 +0100

Agreed, Wolf E, but I think K Dilday's point is more to suggest that just as Europeans minimise the extent of their cultural religiosity, Americans exaggerate it. I don't think Dilday is saying that Europe is more religious in objective terms than America, but rather that the supply of American public piety may rest on an inflated sense of its demand.

Wolf E on "America's pious song and dance"

Wolf E — Tue, 20 May 2008 22:29:55 +0100

A very interesting article, but I must disagree with the claim that religion is at least as important in Europe as it is to Americans, at least with reference to the UK. Having lived in Britain (or England, if you want to be specific) all my life it seems that christenings, church weddings and funerals etc. are far more to do with tradition than religion for many people; this is especially true for christenings, as there aren't many commonly-used secular alternatives for celebrating the birth of a new child. While some people may indeed "pretend that they are less religious than they are", in my experience they are more likely to class themselves automatically as Christians without necessarily going to church or even believing in a Christian god, but again thinking of it more culturally.

Religion is temporarily high up on the political agenda in the UK at the moment with several motions going through Parliament concerning the current Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill, free vote issues on which various religious groups are keen to have their say. However, religion is not usually a significant factor in politics here and it is not the case that "the clergy are an integral and powerful force in politics and each candidate must display public piety", although there are exceptions to this such as Gordon Brown's eagerness to talk about his Presbyterian father, the furore caused by Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg's assertion of his atheism, and the presence of several 'Lords Spiritual' in the House of Lords (although they are an obvious anachronism and will surely be disposed of in any future reform of the upper chamber).

To the foreign observer it seems that American politics is highly nationalistic, and that this nationalism is strongly linked to religion (or, more specifically, Christianity), with candidates only needing to name-drop Jesus or God or whoever to receive rapturous applause (as I saw during a recent Hilary Clinton speech) - this is unimaginable for a mainstream politician here in England, contrary to what you might claim. I’m not quite sure how you define Europe though; you class the UK (or England, as you insist on calling it) as both in Europe in the fourth paragraph and outside it in the fifth, along with Poland, another member of the European Union. Admittedly, though, even many British people’s feelings are similarly confused about the relationship between the UK and Europe.

America's pious song and dance, KA Dilday

KA Dilday — Mon, 19 May 2008 14:04:27 +0100

George W Bush's daughter was married this month by the same minister who delivered the inaugural prayer for Bush in 2000 and 2004. He is Kirbyjon Caldwell, a Black, Houston-based leader of a megachurch who has publicly announced his support for Barack Obama. Caldwell has said that he will campaign with Obama. It's quite likely that Caldwell will replace Jeremiah Wright, who was Barack Obama's pastor until their very public split.

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open Democracy News Analysis - America's pious song and dance, KA Dilday - Comments

Kanishk Tharoor on "America's pious song and dance"

Wolf E on "America's pious song and dance"

America's pious song and dance, KA Dilday