open Democracy News Analysis - Joe who?, Guy Aitchison - Comments

Joel Edelstein on "Joe who?"

Joel Edelstein — Fri, 17 Oct 2008 18:52:55 +0000

Iron Mike, you don't seem to understand a small fact-
income tax is based on income NOT expenses.
You must be joking if you think that there are so many small business that have an income of more than $250,000. If there are, you can hardly call them small
businesses. I suppose you also agree with Joe the Plumber that there should be no social security or I would imagine any taxes at all , excluding of course the defense budget. Not only is Joe the Plumber not a small business man or perhaps even a plumber but
he owes back taxes. Before criticizing Obamas policies it would be nice if you understood them first.

Kanishk Tharoor on "Joe who?"

Kanishk Tharoor — Fri, 17 Oct 2008 09:24:36 +0000

Not to indulge too much in this overblown interest in Joe the Plumber, but there are serious doubts about whether he would in fact pay more taxes under Obama's tax plan.

Also, by Todd Gitlin on TPM:

Joe the Plumber is, it seems, a registered Republican. (Hat tip to Ben Smith of Politico, who got the item from the Toledo Blade.) Moreover, according to the logical Jed L at Daily Kos, he wasn't undecided either:

Speaking with Katie Couric, "Joe" said that he "wasn't swayed" by the debate last night, yet pretty much knew who he was going to vote for. So if (a) he wasn't swayed by the debate and (b) knows who he is going to vote for, then (c) he had already made up his mind before the debate.

Anyway, whether Joe is on the level or not, my sister-in-law, Karen Cook Velasti, makes this interesting point :

Tell Joe the plumber that a business without customers will fail no matter how little or how much he pays in taxes. If people are out of jobs, they won't be able to pay him for repairing his kitchen sink. However, if Joe the middle-class-man or Josephine the middle-class-woman get some of their tax money back or don't have to worry about medical bills, they might be able to hire him for that bathroom renovation they have been putting off.

Thomas Ash on "Joe who?"

Thomas Ash — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 18:54:07 +0000

Palin-Plumber 2012. You read it here first.

Iron Mike on "Joe who?"

Iron Mike — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 17:04:00 +0000

I went to Politico.com and found no such statement that "Joe the Plumber" is not registered to vote. So please provide a link...if you can. But I'm sure ACORN can fix that in any case. Whether he votes or not, he's already helped McCain by exposing the fallacy of Obama's tax plan. All across the nation, small business owners are looking at Joe and seeing themselves. They are being squeezed by the economy and a potential president who threatens to turn a recession into a depression with tax and spend policies to "spread the wealth" around. Nice.

The fact is that Obama is either lying or stupid if he cannot make the connection that a small business earning $250K is more typical than atypical. Five employees earning an average of $50K each is all it takes to meet the threshold. So why are Fox News viewers incensed over cavalier statements by Obama, "spreading the wealth around?" Perhaps because they understand something that eludes Obama's grasp--that it is not the government's wealth to spread; it's theirs.

Chris L on "Joe who?"

Chris L — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 12:14:57 +0000

One interesting tidbit about Joe the Plumber: he's not even registered to vote according to Politico. I guess he won't be helping his buddy John "I can feel your pain" Mccain come election day.

Joe who?, Guy Aitchison

Guy Aitchison — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 11:00:26 +0000

At certain points last night it felt like there were three people taking part in the debate: Obama, McCain and one "Joe the Plumber". Joe first popped up during a discussion of Obama's tax plan and later during the discussion on healthcare. At each mention of his name the candidates would turn sincerely to the camera and explain how they had Joe's best interests at heart.

Now I've been following this campaign pretty closely (it's a guilty pleasure - Huffington Post is my equivalent of Heat magazine) but, tuning into the debate late, I had no idea who Joe was. Was Joe the creation of clever pollsters? Were there thousands of Joe the Plumbers out there, people who would swing this election like the "security moms" supposedly did last time round? Perhaps he was simply the product of McCain's panicked imagination (he is erratic you know). Was this new Joe any relation to "Joe six-pack"? Perhaps they were one and the same.

It was only this morning that I discovered that Joe is very much real (something I expect oD USA readers knew all along). His full name is Joe Wurzelbacher and he comes from Ohio. It was a discussion with him last Sunday that prompted Obama to speak the four short words that so disgusted Fox News readers: "spread the wealth around". After last night's debate Joe is apparently still unconvinced that Obama's tax plan won't punish small businesses like his. Asked about the repeated references to him and his business, Joe declared that it was "pretty surreal, man". Joe - if I can call you Joe - you're not wrong!