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Wyrdtimes on "Remember Remember the 6th of November"

Wyrdtimes — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:45:20 +0100

Who is Davy ranting at?

Toque on "Surveillance: The Big Picture"

Toque — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 11:32:28 +0100

Cheers, I submitted pictures of Police CCTV at Lewes Carnival.

opendemocracy on "Plan-B"

opendemocracy — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 09:59:00 +0100

Thanks Hobbes :) (changed date from August to October -- all those 8's, 10's and "Eights" in both month names...)
BigC - I think there are lessons that should be kept from the 60's and 70's nationalisations. One is that competition often has a real role in curbing the natural tendency of bureaucracy to serve its own interests---competition is a form of "divide and rule". We don't want the finance equivalent of British Leyland serving us. Of course, hyper-competition has been part of the problem we're in and needs to be kept in check - part of the information generated by the "10th bank".
But I guess we've also learned from the 80s utilities privatisations that _ownership_ is not acutally fundamental---regulation is the important part. We could have the 10 banks all state owned and rely on "good" competition to do the work it can do within state ownership. But when the state is 100% owner, can we trust the regulation to be in our interest? We face the same problem towards our elected representatives as Brown and Darling faced towards the banks: with their superior information and executive power, how will we find out the truth about what they're up to? Divide and rule can work against natural potential abuses of power, but it does not work all by itself; the invisible hand is also the weakest one!---it needs us to be political as well.

Tony

BigC on "Plan-B"

BigC — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 20:19:52 +0100

A state bank is a good idea but why should the business it has built up then be sold to private investors? If the state can do it then let it continue doing it. If private investors think they can do it better then let them build up their own business and compete.

owly on "Gordon Thatcher? I don't think so"

owly — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:21:36 +0100

Gordon is doomed. He will be given a good kicking in the up and coming by-election. As to next years Local and EU elections if I were the Labour Party I wouldn't even bother to put up candidates. Roll on a Tory Government who can clear up the mess. Lets hope Labour never hold power again. After all every single Labour Government has f***** up the economy.

Hobbes on "Plan-B"

Hobbes — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:13:53 +0100

Tony--I admire your prescience, but you might want to check the date at the top of your post.

Hobbes on ""Ignorance" in Ohio - take two"

Hobbes — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:04:42 +0100

"Are such demonstrations of emotion admissions of impending defeat? Or inklings of a last ditch Republican tactical coup?"

Neither: they're expressions of frustration and fear, amplified by the experience of being in a crowd of like-minded people. Local power, baffled and agitated by a sense of larger impotence.

I think it's politically important to keep in mind the distinction between "fear of losing" and "admitting defeat." Democratic politics is neither a game nor a war: it is a serious struggle (more is at stake than points scored), but not a scene of conquest and humiliation. It has to be about the recognition and acknowledgment of a common fate, a fate that will be shared by both winners and losers. We can hope that the fate will include a common good, but it will be common in any event.

Triumphalism and self-righteousness are a great danger, especially at a moment of imminent victory. It's more important than ever to try to recognize the legitimacy of those whose desires are being thwarted. That was one of the great failures of Bush II--to govern as if the other side no longer counted. Let's learn the lesson.

Toque on "Remember Remember the 6th of November"

Toque — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 14:09:19 +0100

Why would you turn off the oil?

If you don't mind me asking.

Toque on "Gordon Thatcher? I don't think so"

Toque — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 14:08:06 +0100

I suppose misusing anti-terror laws to freeze the assets of a foreign bank is slightly more acceptable than using them to prosecute people who drop litter or let their dog foul the pavement - in that you're not terrorising your own citizens.

I just thank God that the good Gord is watching over us.

He moves in mysterious ways, he giveth and he taketh away. He's just been on the radio demanding that petrol prices come down. And here's me thinking that it was him that put them up.

What a cretin.

The Cornish Democrat on "Remember Remember the 6th of November"

The Cornish Democrat — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:26:55 +0100

One can only wish the SNP well and hope their and Scotlands lead inspires the Cornish to set the heather alight in the Duchy.

The Cornish Democrat

Hobbes on ""Ignorance" in Ohio"

Hobbes — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:24:43 +0100

They don't "talk" about "bloodlines." One woman, walking away, is asked why she thinks Obama is a terrorist, and responds "it's in his bloodline;" another says, "his name." These are not deeply-held; they're off-hand, heat-of-the-moment responses to someone who's mocking your candidate's rhetoric. It's like asking someone whose team is losing a World Series game: "so, why do you want to kill the umpire?"

I'm not sure how you know what people say after the cameras are turned off since, by definition, they're not on record saying it.

Numerical data may be useful in gauging the extent of certain memes, but it won't help you understand anything. Like anything else, it needs an interpretive frame and a basic grasp of social context before becoming meaningful. In general, statistics removed from their specific context of production should be regarded with deep suspicion.

Thomas Ash on ""Ignorance" in Ohio"

Thomas Ash — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 08:54:30 +0100

Hobbes, what's your reason for thinking these people are acting when they talk about "bloodlines", etc.? Do people in Ohio laugh about hoodwinking reporters after the cameras are turned off? Serious question... I'm not dismissing what you say, but it's hard to believe without some evidence.

And for the record, numerical data is valuable in understanding the beliefs of middle-class Europeans too... it's not just for distant tribes.

frankfurterschool on ""Ignorance" in Ohio"

frankfurterschool — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 00:17:57 +0100

Having spend the first 18 years of life in Ohio and then having lived in New York and California since then, I can attest that these people depicted here and their opinions are very "real" and although some seem to be enjoying a performance for the camera, they are not play-acting.

There are regional differences that is for sure. But the idea that people can be viewed as entirely "representative" is a flawed one; these people surely represent some, but not all. There are plenty of ignorant people on the coasts. Plenty of McCain/Palin stickers in California and plenty of dumb racists in Los Angeles.

There are two important points to recognize in this discussion: the McCain/Palin campaign is using fear, ignorance and hatred to whip up frenzied mobs, which has historically been a very effective tool for seizing power in fascist regimes. Secondly, the overuse of "difference" to rationalize people with whom you disagree, (regional difference, class difference, differing race, religion, nationality, etc) is not a useful response -- it further divides us and fails to address the core problems that we all face in trying to fight for democracy.

Davy G on "Remember Remember the 6th of November"

Davy G — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 22:47:21 +0100

usual hilarious input. I wonder what 'value ' a real commodity like N Sea Oil now holds in this equation? We know the mainstream narrative about the Barnett (zzzzzz) Formula. But will Daily Telegraphland ACTUALLY be laughing when we turn off the oil? I suspect your facetious, smug ignorant views will change.

Kanishk Tharoor on ""Ignorance" in Ohio"

Kanishk Tharoor — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 22:43:02 +0100

Hobbes, thanks for your comment. I hope you realise I was expressing scepticism about the video precisely for the same reasons as you... "hinterland" is in quotations because I don't think it's a term with any content, just as it is ridiculous for people to claim to see "Red State America" in a video like this. these are misleading - and dangerous - terms, exploited all too often by those who want to live in their comforting simplicity.