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just curiousPosts: Joined: 2005-12-24
I've read many times that muslim unity is the answer for most of the middle eastern problems. What exactly is that and how is it established?
Does unity involve discovering which school of Islamic thought and/or cultural interpretation gets to dominate the Islamic world in this one political rule? Is unity the acceptance of differences in muslim countries?
Does this decision ultimately have to be made by the outcome of threats and reality of violence, or debate?
How does an honest debate occur without threats of murder for having the wrong opinion?
I would also like to know if muslims think this unity could possibly be achieved without the independent insight of women.
Submitted on Sat, 2007-12-01 21:04
group is better than individual
candace we wish that all arabic and muslim countries unite in one opinion and it is logic that when many people are together they would be more powerful and now europe unite and if we want to be effective also especially in resolving the ME conflict, we must have one voice and not divisable of course women will share and she is very important element, in all issues of lifes.  one opinion.
[quote=abdulksaida]we wish that all arabic and muslim countries unite in one opinion and it is logic that when many people are together they would be more powerful [/quote]
Unite in one opinion about what? Are you talking about the Caliphate, or are you refering to the problem of the uncompromising way in which "some men" in Arab and Muslim countries cope with being offended by different opinions.
sharing
[quote]of course women will share and she is very important element, in all issues of lifes.[/quote]
yes, as long as they don't argue with what the men decide is the one opinion.
Peace, Love and Teddy Bears.
The problems in the Middle East would be far easier to solve is Muslims weren't quite so keen to kill one another. While abdulksalda might think women 'will share' in this glorious dream one doubts she would have equal rights with men, although on past form she doesn't seem that bothered about that. It would also be a mark of progress if they were more accepting of other beliefs and religions. But least there will be lots of other people to persecute - Jews, Christians etc and lets not even mention the treatment of Homosexuals.
Owly
Quote:It would
Owly [quote]It would also be a mark of progress if they were more accepting of other beliefs and religions. But least there will be lots of other people to persecute - Jews, Christians etc and lets not even mention the treatment of Homosexuals. [/quote] The vast majority of muslims are completely accepting of other faiths. It is a very small minority who exhibit the murderous intolerance to which you refer. The main reason these people are in power in countries like Oman, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan is because the West supported and financed them in order to keep out secular reformers. As to the persecution of Jews and homosexuals, to my knowledge the guards in the Nazi concentration and extermination camps were Eastern European Christians. They murdered 6 million Jews and goodness how many homosexuals, gipsies and socialists and communists. I'm afraid the Christians are way in front in the murderous intolerance stakes. I'll agree with you on one pont. The treatment of homosexuals in muslim communities is a disgrace. The rest of your rant is inaccurate - there are Jewish communities in most Muslim states and they are not persecuted or discriminated against. Muslim Intolerance
BigC, Its a pity you don't read more about the Middle East, Islam and Muslims attitudes towards other faiths. For a start it is impossible to build a church, let alone hold a Christian service, in Saudi Arabia. I for one have made this point before, and the attitude of our Muslim posters is one of indifference or actually agreeing with this proscription. Also no Christian many visit Mecca. So I'm glad you see this as 'completely accepting of other faiths'. In Egypt until very recently it was impossible to build or to repair a church without the approval of the President. Coptic Christians were long established in Egypt before Mohammed was even born. I did meet a man in New York who had been a high ranking Civil Servant in Cairo but had been forced to flee because of Muslim intolerance. He was a Coptic Christian. As to your point re Nazi concentration camps I believe you are wrong. Many of the SS Guards were actually Germans. You might also like to know that in Sudan at least 2 million people have been murdered by Islamic 'forces' and 4 million forced to flee. One could go on and on listing examples here and now of Islams intolerance to those of other faiths but such examples would not suit your 'rant'. Oh and by the way the West had nothing to do with the rise to power of either the Saudis or indeed of Nasser in Egypt. Sorry to spoil that little 'rant'.
Owly says:
For a start it
Owly says:
[quote]For a start it is impossible to build a church, let alone hold a Christian service, in Saudi Arabia. I for one have made this point before, and the attitude of our Muslim posters is one of indifference or actually agreeing with this proscription. Also no Christian many visit Mecca.[/quote] Yes it is a very repressive state. But it accounts for about 2% of the muslim world. Hardly a significant number. I repeat, most muslims are tolerant of other religions. [quote]As to your point re Nazi concentration camps I believe you are wrong. Many of the SS Guards were actually Germans. [/quote] Yes there were German guards in charge. It was also Germans who organised the rounding up and deportations. It remains that the camps were mostly staffed by Ukrainians, Latvians and Lithuanians. Even if you were right it would be a meaningless point. Germany happens to be a Christian country too! People like to shrug off the holocaust and say it was the Nazis. But the Nazis didn't come from nowhere. The anti-semitism, the homophobia...that all comes from European Christian tradition. [quote]You might also like to know that in Sudan at least 2 million people have been murdered by Islamic 'forces' and 4 million forced to flee.[/quote] The Sudanese government is persecuting Black Aficans whether they are Christians or not. The people being killed in Darfur are also Muslims. Again, you are using one tiny part of the Muslim world to condemn all. [quote] Oh and by the way the West had nothing to do with the rise to power of either the Saudis or indeed of Nasser in Egypt. Sorry to spoil that little 'rant'. [/quote] You are right, the Al Saud clan rose and fell out of power over the last 200 years or so without Western aid or support - though there were occasional alliances. However, at the time that the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia was declared in 1932 the whole of the Middle east was dominated by Britain, France and the US. They effectively dictated all the borders of all the states in the region and the state would not have been established without their acceptance. Furthermore, Saudi Arabia's relationship with Britain and the US since that date has been umbillical - They have depended on the west for their armaments and the Saudi princes have always travelled to Paris and London for their gambling, whoring and drinking. I'm not sure why you mentioned Nasser. I didn't. He was the secular leader who nationalised the Suez canal and humiliated the British and French when they tried to take it back without asking permission from their bosses in Washington. Although he wasn't a communist he was supported by the russians. His successors have however moved closer to the US and Egypt is now one of the largest recipents of US aid. |
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