A society with enormous disparities of income and wealth is not going to be a democracy, even if it is one on paper
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Mugabe, a tyrant to the end.
Zimbabwe will always be better than Rhodesia
"When is this murdering piece of scum going to resign ??" That's what I used to say about Thatcher. Open Democracy are very busy using Tibet to bash China with at the moment - so Zimbabwe will just have to wait a bit. People are 'starving' in Zimbabwe? Really? A rather grand sweeping statement there. I would love to see some evidence.
Submitted on Mon, 2008-03-31 23:40
reply 
 evidence of starvation and corruption are everywhere
Courtney, [quote] People are 'starving' in Zimbabwe? Really? A rather grand sweeping statement there. I would love to see some evidence. [/quote] All you have to do is Google "starvation" and "Zimbabwe" and you get 329,000 hits! Unlike the circular arguments over Darfur, there is plenty of evidence of food shortages due to a poor harvest and drought compunded by corruption and economic collapse. Nor is it the first time a political power has used hunger to gain and maintain power. http://www.csmonitor.com/2008/0325/p06s02-woaf.html [quote] In Zimbabwe, bread costs Z$10 million
Bulawayo, Zimbabwe - In her pink-and-yellow Indian sari, Neeti Patel sees the customers come into her shop, look longingly at the sandwiches, and walk back out empty handed. It's not that her prices are high – a sausage sandwich sells for a mere 30 million Zimbabwe dollars, or about $1.25. The problem is that Zimbabwe's skyrocketing inflation – now the world's highest, running at more than 100,000 percent a year – keeps her costs rising. A 30-pound bag of potatos cost 90 million in the first week of March. Now that same bag costs 160 million, and her potential customers simply don't have the money. Economic sanctions levied by Western countries on Mugabe's regime don't explain a huge growth in government spending which now equals nearly 60 percent of the total gross domestic product, he says. With a manufacturing industry now operating at just 5 percent of capacity – largely due to a lack of reliable electricity and water – there are fewer taxes to pay for that spending, and Zimbabwe has fallen deeper into debt. Most troubling, however, is the way Zimbabwe lost its ability to feed itself, and the region. In 1979, when Mugabe's nationalist rebels overthrew the white-dominated government of Rhodesia, and changed the name of the country to Zimbabwe, thousands of commercial farms managed to grow enough food to export throughout the region. Today, more than a decade of mismanagement and neglect have dropped agricultural production to precolonial levels. [/quote]
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 01:22
reply
Zimbabwe will always be better than Rhodesia
Many thanks Iron Mike for your contribution, you did well to not fall into the trap of singing the praises of Rhodesia during this current crisis in Zimbabwe - unlike many of its British critics.
However, the well researched article that you kindly linked is not evidence of starvation in Zimbabwe. On the contrary, the article actually supports my thesis that 'starvation does not exist in Zimbabwe'. Indeed, the article argues that food "from friendly neighbors, from the United Nations' World Food I'd suggest that you go back to Google and try a bit harder this time. As for mentioning Darfur, are you also under the misguided impression that a genocide has been happening there over the past 5 years? It would be quite instructive to hear your thoughts and see your evidence on that particular issue - however, I'm sure you do not believe all that nonsense about 'genocide', or maybe you do, we will just have wait and see what your African expertise can conjure up from Google. Niether bored or enraged, just amused.
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 07:36
reply In denial
Courtney, Why is it you seem unable to be critical of a Tyrant like Mugabe ? Since he came to power 28 years ago he has effectively destroyed the country he is supposed to be govening. As IM pointed out inflation is at 100000%; the country is importing food aid (which the old Tyrant is using as a political weapon) and yet under Ian Smith it was a bread basket of Africa. The reason for your love of Mugabe is probably two fold. A) He is black, and one can't possible be critical of him as that would be racist (the fact he is the biggest racist around you conveniently overlooked). B) He is a Marxist and therefore a 'brother'. You are more to be pitted than laughed at. Oh and do tell us all when you were last in Darfur.
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 08:59
reply Mugabe's no brother
Owly Zanu PF probably characterised itself as Marxist Leninist to get help from the Soviets. The only remotely Marxist thing it has DONE (a more reliable indicator surely) is it's laughable land reform. That only started to take place when the Zanu PF veterans started turning against it - so it was a half hearted attempt to buy them off rather than a serious ideological move. Mugabe is a monster and a crook. But he's not a Marxist. BTW - in fairness to your challenge to Courtney (with whom I disagree on this occasion) I think you have to tell us when you were in Darfur too. If you weren't then please explain the value of the challenge.
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 12:42
reply Amused?
The only thing that's amuses me here is Courtney's ridicule of Google, when that's all anyone does here. Alright, there's wikipedia too, but how often does anyone actually go out an research these issues in a library or ask an educated expert about these matters before coming back to pose their arguments? My humblest apologies if you are an educated expert ;-) At best, I have educated guesses...
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 12:57
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Zimbabwe: not quite the White Man's Burden
In denial? Oh, I see, I'm in denial therefore you must be right - is that it? Dear Owly, my love for the democratically elected leader of Zimbabwe, is the same as my love for the unelected political leader of Britain. You are right Owly, during the rule of Ian Smith, all black people were nothing but second class citizens, but at least they could afford a loaf of bread to eat, unlike today. What is all too easily forgotten in Zimbabwean politics is that the ruthlessness of Mugabe's administration was forged during the often brutal struggle against white supremacy. Indeed, it was the West who taught Mugabe everything he knows about ruling with an iron fist. Don't get me wrong here, the blame for the current economic crisis lays at the feet of Zanu-PF - however, flippant and abusive talk directed against what the majority of Zimbabweans would call a hero, ends up actually being counterprodutive. This critical point was not lost in The Observer, who editorialised last year that "Britain has mishandled Mugabe. Our verbal attacks have made him stronger". So carry on the good work Owly. Also, I do not need to go to Darfur to ague that there is no genocide happening there. The U.N and the E. U have both led special investigations to the region and what they saw did not amount to genocide, no serious international organisation labels the civil war there as genocide. So you tell me Owly, what have you found in Darfur that specialist teams from the E.U & the U.N failed to see?
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 14:42
reply
Word games
Courtney, Seems like your big problem with the issue of Darfur is one of labling. You don't like the label "genocide" but do not deny thousands dying brutal death and displacement. Fine. Call it mass murder and its still as objectionable, right? Similarly with starvation in Zimbabwe. Are you arguing semantics? Is it the word "starvation" that you have a problem with? Because there is certainly evidence of widespread hunger, failed crops, drought, political corruption and disasterous economic poilicy. Do you prefer to label it something else? If so, what?
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 14:38
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Like this one better?
If the issue at question is whether or not there is a food shortage, this article is on point. http://www.thestar.com/News/World/article/356962 [quote] As resentment of the former national liberation hero grew, he ratcheted up repression against real and suspected opponents, from political foes to ordinary people who lost their livelihoods and homes to brutal "cleansing" programs. Political opponents were jailed. Some were tortured or beaten, including the popular leader of the Movement for Democratic Change, Morgan Tsvangirai, a front-runner in opinion polls. Meanwhile, soaring food prices led to countrywide starvation, and alarm bells from the World Food Program, which declared more than 3 million Zimbabweans unable to feed themselves. Up to 3 million more people have fled the country and average life expectancy has plummeted to under 36. [/quote] Not sure what issue you have with Google. Frankly, it keeps everyone honest since so much more information is available--especially through Google government and academic searches, though certainly Solve's posts demonstrate that not every source generated by Google is equal in credibility. The "reasonable man" standard is still important.
Submitted on Tue, 2008-04-01 23:49
reply Courtney Hamilton wrote:What
[quote=Courtney Hamilton]What is all too easily forgotten in Zimbabwean politics is that the
What this amounts to is excusing Mugabe because of Imperialism. Yes
The man is a tyrant. He has rigged elections, bankrupted his country,
[quote=Courtney Hamilton]flippant and abusive talk directed against what the majority of
There is nothing flippant about criticizing Mugabe. And secondly, see
Submitted on Mon, 2008-05-26 09:57
reply Post new comment |
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It now seems to be clear that Robert Mugabe is planning to 'steal' this election like he has the last two. I doubt the people will allow him to get away with it.
When is this murdering piece of scum going to resign ?? Looks like there are three possible outcomes -:
1. Mugabe could resign and leave the country.
2. The people will rise up in revolt and he will be forced from office.
3. The Army will overthrow him - probably junior officers.
Lets see what happens. But it is a pity Open Democracy is so disinterested in Zimbabwe. In 28 years in power Mugabe has destroyed his own country to the point that his people are now starving. What a disgrace.