The Infest ... er, Occupy Movement -- an idea whose time should never have come is now going

Recent news updates from Occupy protests read like a crime blotter: A man shot near the encampment in Oakland. A homeless person dead in Salt Lake City. A suicide in Vermont. Two drug overdoses and a molotov cocktail in downtown Portland, Ore. A sexual assault in Philadelphia. Hypothermia in Denver ... and a 53-year-old man unnoticed in his tent in New Orleans, dead for at least two days.

Even more prevalent are city concerns about sanitation. Thousands of protesters have lived outdoors with few toilets and no showers for the better part of two months.

Protesters in Chicago violated a noise ordinance; a protester in New York defecated on a police car. In Oakland, when police officers forcibly cleared protesters from Frank Ogawa Plaza this week, in part to deal with a rat infestation, cleaning crews hauled away more than 100 tents, dozens of molded mattresses and 27.8 tons of trash.

And now, as The Washington Post reports, cities are finally clearing out these cesspools in public parks. A group of some hundreds of New Yorkers protested the protesters earlier in the week, telling them to clear out. And the movement, which is calling for more fiscal responsibility, is costing the cities it's occupying millions of dollars.

With the clearing of New York's Zuccotti Park, the movement's birthplace, cities are finally taking back their citizens' public spaces. The true 99 percent is finally speaking up.

No.  I just refuse to go

No.  I just refuse to go through my short time on the earth as a morose, melancholy mope.

There are many instances of great humor at the expense of Hitler/Nazis.  Some of it even written by people who suffered the most (Jews) at the hands of Hitler/Nazis.  If you would like to start with a couple classics, I would suggest"  The Producers, and To Be, or Not to Be (with Jack Benny).

Or, if you don't have an attention span long enough to start with those two, try this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a6YS6t5weo

“There are many instances of

There are many instances of great humor at the expense of Hitler/Nazis

You’ve been applauding humour at the expense of the victims.

It's called "gallows humor",

It's called "gallows humor", or "sick jokes."  Quite common amongst us evil, nasty Americans.

Can Little Billy come out and play?

You know Billy dosen't have any arms or legs.

We know.  But we want to put him on the hot asphalt and watch him flop around.

or

Can Billy come out and play?

You know Billy doesn't have any arms or legs.

We know.  But we wanna use him for second base.

Nothing to do with gallows

Nothing to do with gallows humour. Applauding jokes about mass murder and genocide is the same as applauding mass murder and genocide. Your point of view in this sort of joke decidedly is that of the perpetrator. It is called normalisation.

whatever

whatever

And of course I would never

And of course I would never forget my friend, Henry Hart...

Oh Jay ... *sniff* ... you

Oh Jay ... *sniff* ... you shouldn't have!

(No subject)

Reminds me of a conversation

Reminds me of a conversation I had with a friend last week. We were talking about cremation versus burials.  I said I intend to be cremated and have my ashes spread in the Ozarks. He said he told his wife he wanted her to put his ashes in a douchebag and drop it off at a whorehouse.

I told him I hope she doesn't get his instructions mixed up and put his ashes in a enema bag and leave it at a YMCA.

And here is one for Mike...

And here is one for Mike...

Awesome!  Brings tears to my

Awesome!  Brings tears to my eyes.

The Freikorps re-awakes

The Freikorps re-awakes

And a Leonard Cohen offering

And a Leonard Cohen offering for Momo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be60--LsAfE

An authoritarian nationalist

An authoritarian nationalist linking to “The Partisan”. You are immune to the irony of it, aren’t you?

Let's see...  Irony, right? 

Let's see...  Irony, right?  The man is singing about taking up arms to fight for something he believes in.  Specifically, a French partisan, fighting against the Germans.  Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the French partisans were supplied with weapons by the U.S. (and other alies), and very much welcomed American military might to drive out the Germans.  There are many times when an outside nation comes to the aid of another, militarily.  We would not have gained independance from Britain without the assistance of the French.  France would not have thrown off the Germans without our help.  A lot of countries have welcomed our military assistance.  Some, not so much.  The question is...  When is it right, and when is it wrong.  The answer is not...  It is always wrong.

Then, throw in the fact that Mr. Cohen is a jewish Canadian who, in 1973, went Israel to volunteer during the Israel - Egypt war.  I believe he wanted to be an Israeli paratrooper, but they felt he was of more value entertaining frontline troops, at times under fire.

I see no irony in the words and sentiments of someone who believes there are times, and causes, that are worth defending.  Someone who normally looks for peaceful means to resolve conflicts, but understands there are times that such means are not an option.

I do see irony in the fact that someone who thinks taking up arms is never justified is critical of someone who understands there are times when it is the only choice.

“I see no irony in the words

I see no irony in the words and sentiments of someone who believes there are times, and causes, that are worth defending.”

The irony is in YOUR quoting such a person!

I really don’t know  why this should be too difficult for you to get, but you still list nationalities in your posts. Sorting a person into a box is all you need to know, to judge that person. You would have been a good guard in a death camp, because that’s what it was about.  And now you will protest that this is not true because you are American and Americans can never be wrong, and even if they are they still have the right to kill everyone else who is not American, and of course every dissenter too. At the same time you claim antifascism for you—by virtue of your nationality of course.

Re-read your first paragraph, Alan. Tell me, do you still fail to see what you are doing there? It’s really incredible.

 

I do see irony in the fact that someone who thinks taking up arms is never justified is critical of someone who understands there are times when it is the only choice

Ah, and I suppose that you mean me by that. I’ve never said that. No matter for you: you aren’t interested in what a German actually said. You are American and claim the right to distort my words as you please.

 

So, is there any connection between the French resistance and the present movement? Clearly, yes. I suspect you, an authoritarian, friend of dehumanisation, advocate of torture, militarist, won’t like that: Stephane Hessel has called for exactly this resistance which you want to be fought.

I suspect that voluntarily you wouldn’t read a partisan’s words on the crises of our days, so you must be spoonfed:

In London, where I had joined General de Gaulle in March 1941, I learned that this Council had developed a program, which was adopted in March, 1944 and which porposed to Liberated France a set of principles and values which supported the democracy of Our modern country(1) . Of these principles and values, is that we need TODAY more than ever. It behooves us all together to ensure that our society is a society in which we are proud of: not of this society of undocumented papers, expulsions, suspicions against immigrants, not this society that challenges pensions, the achievemnets of Social Security, not this society where the media are in the hands of the moneyed classes, all things that we would have refused to endorse if we were the true heirs of the National Council of Resistance. From1945, after a terrible tragedy, it was an ambitious resurrection which engaged the forces present in the Council of Resistance. Remember, then they created Social Security as the Resistance wished, as the program stated: ” A comprehensive plan for Social Security, to ensure livelihoods for all citizens, in all cases or if they are unable to obtain them through work “,” a pension to the old workers to assure a dignified end of their days. “The energy sources, electricity and gas, coal, the major banks were nationalized. That’s what this program was still stating: “the return to the nation of the major means of production, produced by common sources of energy, wealth of the subsoil, insurance companies and large banks; ” the establishment of genuine economic  and social democracy involving the eviction of large feudal economic and financial  that directed the economy. ” The public interest must prevail over the interest individual, the fair sharing of the wealth created by the world of work override the power of  money. The Resistance said ” a rational organization of the economy to ensure the subordination of special individual  interests to the public interest and free from the dictatorship introduced to the professional image of fascist states”. A real democracy needs a free press, and the Resistance knows this and states “The press freedom, its  honor and independence againt the power of the State, the power of money and foreign influences.” That is what turns further orders on the press in 1944. Yet that is what is now in danger. The Resistance was calling for “an effective opportunity for all French children to benefit from the most developed education”, without discrimination, yet the reforms proposed in 2008 go against this project. Young teachers, which actions I support, were up to refuse to apply them and they saw their wages cut as a punishment. They were outraged, have “disobeyed” and found these reforms too far from the ideal of the republican school, too much in the service of the money society and not enough developing the creative and critical thinking. It is just the base of the social conquests of the Resistance which is now in question (2) .

The reason of the Resistance was outrage.

We dare say that  the State was no longer covering  the costs of these civic action. But how can it lack today the money to maintain and extend these achievements while production of wealth has increased considerably since the Liberation period when Europe was ruined? If not because the power of money, so fought by the Resistance, has never been greater, insolent, selfish, with his own servants into the highest echelons of the State. Banks are now privatized and  first show of their conscious dividends and high salaries of their leaders, not the general interest. The gap between the poorest and richest has never been so important, and the race for money, the competition has never been so encouraged. The basic pattern of resistance was indignation. We, veterans of resistance movements and fighting forces of Liberated France, we call the younger generations to stand up, to transmit the heritage of the Resistance and its ideals. We say take over, cry out!  The political and economic responsibles, the intellectuals and all society shall not resign or be intimidated by the current international dictatorship of financial markets that threatens the peace and democracy. I wish you all, to each of you to have your design indignation. Is invaluable. When something get you outraged, as I was outraged by the Nazis, then you have to become  an activist, strong and committed. We joined the stream of history and the mainstream of the history must continue through each. And this trend is towards more justice, more freedom but not this freedom of uncontrolled fox in the henhouse. These rights, including the Universal Declaration drafted the program in 1948, are universal. If you meet someone who doesn’t benefit of those, help him to conquer them.

Horse hockey.  Like I said,

Horse hockey.  Like I said, there are times when resistance by arms is necessary.  There are times when a fight is the only option left.  There are times when armed partisans and armed allies are needed to stop someone.  Occupy Wall Street is not one of those times.  You seem to think any fight against authority, money, capitalism, power, or business is automatically right.  I would rather work within my American system to make things better for my children than sit around bitching and moaning and demanding the entire system be dismantled.  As I said once before, on this site, the Ford Motor Company provided the opportunity for a hell of a lot of Americans to buy homes, educate their children, feed their families, and afford medical care.  I dare say, Henry Ford provided better lives for a hell of a lot more Americans than all of the Occupy protesters put together.  Even if he got rich while doing it.

I have no doubt you support the OWS protesters.  After all, they want to bitch about "the system" and "the rich".  And you're "all in" when that hand is played.  I just think it's stupid to be such a knee jerker.

Have you raised  any 

Have you raised  any  arguments for your rejection of the occupy movement? No. All you have are vilifications and violence.

Here you go... I reject the

Here you go...

 

I reject the notion that all the economic ills of the world are the fault of Wall Street, banks, and the wealthy, that socialist policies had nothing to do with the economic downturn.

I reject the notion that government spending will cure the problem.

I reject the notion that we should steal from the rich and give to the poor.

I reject the notion that the government owes you a home, a job, and education, medical care, or any other cradle-to-grave socialist system, expecting the "rich" will pay for all of it (especially when such systems remove any incentive to become rich in the first place).

I have faith that the economy will turn around.

I have believe the only thing preventing huge investments in new jobs and new factories and new products is the massive amount of stupid regulations placed on private enterprises.

I believe the economy will explode when companies begin investing, the week after Obama is replaced by a Republican, and those stupid regulations are relaxed/removed.

I believe a recovery depends on a change in the White House and in the Legislature, and camping in tents on city parks will do absolutely nothing to create jobs.

On top of all that, I believe most of those in the OWS protests are a bunch of whiners who are not representative of the vast majority of American who are willing to work damn hard to get ahead, and don't just expect the government to give them everything.

And, as a final thought, I believe I have the right to laugh at the stupidity they represent.  Andthey certainly provide plenty of laughs.

You believe. That’s what you

You believe. That’s what you can do in church. I had asked a question about politics, not religion. Have you any arguments?

 

I note that you lost interest in debating the French resistance as soon as you were enlightened what they used to fight for (as opposed to what they fought against). How come? Come, spell it out.

The reasons I don't support

The reasons I don't support the OWS protesters are found in my beliefs.

I have not lost interest in debating the French resistance with you.  For  me to have lost something would imply I had an interest at one time, in order to have lost it.

Understand, most times, I barely skim over your posts.  Especially anything longer than a sentence or two.  Because I refuse to be dragged into the pessimistic, sour outlook on life you possess. 

This is the last semi-serious post you'll drag from me on this thread.  I honestly feel sorry for you.  It must be a miserable life to be so humorless.

“I have not lost interest in

I have not lost interest in debating the French resistance with you.  For  me to have lost something would imply I had an interest at one time, in order to have lost it

It was you, not me, who linked to “The Partisan”. Why?

Because I refuse to be dragged into the pessimistic, sour outlook on life you possess

I honestly feel sorry for you.  It must be a miserable life to be so humorless

Not sharing your belief system for you is a “pessimistic, sour outlook”. Not sharing your taste for jokes highlighting mass murder makes one humourless in your view then. Well. You are probably unaware of how hollow you sound.

(No subject)

“It’s a joke!” Sure. Mass

“It’s a joke!”

Sure. Mass murder is a joke by Jay.

Mass murder?  I am talking

Mass murder?  I am talking about a dauchsund in a hot dog bun.

Stop biting the dog, Momo.  Your sense of humor is the wurst.

Reading this conversation is

Reading this conversation is like passing by a dark room in a basement with the only light coming from a window. There's some guy sitting on the floor picking away at his scabs.You can't tell if he's talking to himself or the person yelling from the other room.

You remember you left a message for someone you thought was staying there and you look for it.. Just as your about to leave you glance over at him, he catches you looking at him and asks you if you've seen his puppy,  you look and see some half eaten moldy bun a few feet away from him.  CREEPY.. omg.yikes

My, you do insist on your

My, you do insist on your prerogerative to change the subject! You don't claim royal privileges, I guess, this is probably again a matter of nationality. Or of the left being without any rights.

I am talking about your joking about the holocaust. And I am seeing it against the background of the racism you have shown me, which I have not forgotten and will not forget. How far will your inhumanity (which matches the title Henry chose for this thread) reach? Neither of you tries to argue against the movement you oppose, I note.

“Like I said, there are times

Like I said, there are times when resistance by arms is necessary.”

Actually what you said is: I do see irony in the fact that someone who thinks taking up arms is never justified is critical of someone who understands there are times when it is the only choice” insinuating that I had said that, which is FALSE.

“You seem to think any fight against authority, money, capitalism, power, or business is automatically right.”

You seem to think any fight against authority, money, capitalism, power, or business is automatically wrong!

“I would rather work within my American system…”

Ah, everything else is un-American again!

“I just think it's stupid to be such a knee jerker”

Not subscribing to your ideology makes one a knee-jerker, of course.

 

I note that you are too much a coward to answer the accusation of racism which I raised.

I note that you are too much

I note that you are too much a coward to answer the accusation of racism which I raised.

I must have missed it.  Here's my response... get stuffed.

 

Selective perception. I am

Selective perception. I am not surprised.

Brendan,In this time of

Brendan,

In this time of Americans giving thanks, I'd like to thank you northern North Americans for allowing us to borrow Leonard Cohen for the past 40-plus years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYcCWThco6I

Jay,Now that you've learned

Jay,

Now that you've learned to photoshop posters, could you make one for me?  I'd like to have one with a grubby hippy-type holding a poster that says:

"If I had a nickle for every time I shit in your park, I wouldn't need a job."

 

Alan,All right buddy.  Fixed

Alan,

All right buddy.  Fixed this one up special for my Tennessee friend.  Thanks for Davy Crockett and the gang...

You Know, I don't think there

You Know, I don't think there is ever a time when taking a shit on a cop car is not a good gag. I'm going to do my best to shit on one on Monday.

I suspect that 99% of jurors

I suspect that 99% of jurors would exonerate the cop or cops who shot this shithead after catching him crapping on their cruiser...

Alan,Anything for you ole

Alan,

Anything for you ole buddy.  Give me a few minutes and let me see what I can come up with.

Yes yes yes, I know.  Sexist,

Yes yes yes, I know.  Sexist, misogynistic, vaguely creepy in an internet sorta way.  She is really going to be upset now.

But if the black girl in the background can totally check out her backside, then why can't we laugh a little about the unfairness of it all?

(No subject)

Brendan,Typical.  This woman

Brendan,

Typical.  This woman does not know the difference between her but and her as.  That should read, "Now would be agreeable to me, AS I am interested in your opinion."

Another unpaid student loan down the drain.

WikiSatire is primarily a

Wiki

Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.

A common feature of satire is strong irony or sarcasm—"in satire, irony is militant"[2]—but parody, burlesque, exaggeration, juxtaposition, comparison, analogy, and double entendre are all frequently used in satirical speech and writing. This "militant" irony or sarcasm often professes to approve of (or at least accept as natural) the very things the satirist wishes to attack.

Henry, Mike, Jay,Happy

Henry, Mike, Jay,

Happy Thanksgiving to y'all.  I hope you get to enjoy time with family.  Try not to eat too much.

AP

Likewise my friend!  Ran my

Likewise my friend!  Ran my 15K on Thanksgiving and lounged afterwards with family, turkey, beer, and football.  I was pretty satisfied with my 1:38:05 time, but tempered by the fact that I was passed by a lady with a double stroller and a guy in a wheelchair  (no kidding).

Alan,Thanks buddy.  Happy

Alan,

Thanks buddy.  Happy Thanksgiving to you too.  Going to mom's at noon, then to a friend's at 4.  Going to be a tryptophan overdose.

Now if you will excuse me, I just learned how to make a fake poster.  Looking for the right pic right now.

Alan,With an encore!!!  The

Alan,

With an encore!!!  The best weapon against the Flea Party is indeed photoshop.

(No subject)

(No subject)

Alan,Thank you my friend. 

Alan,

Thank you my friend.  This is a prime example of why photoshop is one of the best inventions of my lifetime.

(No subject)

“As a citizen, I don't want

As a citizen, I don't want to live in a society where disruptive individuals refuse to follow orders of the police,” (Jay)

This sums up Jay’s vision of what democracy is. Follow orders of the police. Don’t think. Don’t move. Obey.

 

Brendan,I just noticed this:

Brendan,

I just noticed this:

At 8:40 “Mr. O’Reilly, sir, there is no correlation of raising taxes and unemployment,” and added “If you can show it to me, I’ll eat your shoe.”

The "talking point" of the wingnut disinformation campaign is a simplistic platitude with not a shred of truth to it. No economist would say such a thing, it is simply false, get it? Attacking the democrats or OWS with such hogwash only plays in the ideologically aligned peanut gallery. It's just more American ignorance on display.

Take a deep breath, man.  If we work together as a society, we CAN find a way to provide liberty, justice, and prosperity for all.  We need to take a step back from our ideologies and keep our minds open.

I watched that video, and I agreed with much of what O'Reilly said, much of what Stein said, and much of what the "entrepreneur/investor" said, but none of them was representing the entire picture.

There most definitely is a correlation between taxes and unemployment.  There is also a correlation between interest rates and unemployment.  If I take money out of your wallet, bank account, and savings, it is going to influence your spending habits.  You have finite resources; its that simple.  When you tax people you reduce consumption.  When you tax businesses you reduce investment.  That factors into the equation and reduces growth, or even contracts the economy, and that slows job growth or even results in layoffs.

You can take a look at the economic booms that happened after the Kennedy tax cuts and the Reagan tax cuts.  The government actually took in more revenue after cutting taxes, because they expanded the economy and created more incomes, more businesses, and more profits to tax.

Now I am not saying that I am opposed to new taxes.  I am not a tea-partier.  I am not saying that I don't want government programs to aid the neediest and improve the health of the overall society.

I understand that you want a better world for your children, but you are looking at the problems emotionally.  A little less ideology and bit more reasoning would make the picture clearer.  Sometimes liberal policies sound like the right thing, but they have unintended consequences that eventually wind up outsourcing your job to China.  Be smart.