Osama Bin Laden is dead

Taken from the Huffington Post:

Osama Bin Laden is dead, President Obama will announce, according to multiple news organizations. The U.S. is in possession of his body, a person familiar with the situation told the Associated Press late Sunday.

President Obama is scheduled to address the nation on the developments Sunday night.

It was unclear where how bin Laden was killed and how the U.S. captured his body.

 

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Welcome back!   Much of the

Welcome back!   Much of the same drivel and always with a hard Left Euro-twist. Thank God for Owly or I'd have written off the whole continent.  :-)

What amazes me is that even the killing of the most wanted terrorist in the world still provokes blame toward the US instead of gratitude; not that we need their gratitude, but they are most certainly beneficiaries of US blood and treasure.  It would not kill them to admit it.

What amazes me is that even

What amazes me is that even the killing of the most wanted terrorist in the world

I must have missed something. Who was killed while we have been talking about bin Laden?

I must have missed

I must have missed something.

Yes, you did.

Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

Martin Luther King, Jr.

And that's what makes you and your type dangerous.

… while you and your type are

… while you and your type are dangerous because of your terrorist policies to increase terrorism.

Ungratefully yours

Except Henry already debunked

Except Henry already debunked that myth quite effectively.  Perhaps you should do a little research first.  Heres a great article from 2008 

Terrorist attacks decrease worldwide as support from Muslim world wanes

 21 May 2008 [MEDIAGLOBAL]: Global deaths from terrorism have declined significantly in recent months, due in part to dwindling popular support for Islamist terrorist groups in the Muslim world, according to the Human Security Brief 2007, launched today at United Nations Headquarters.

The shift is a product of “the Islamists shooting themselves in their feet. They’ve become their own worst enemy,” said Andrew Mack, Director of the Human Security Report Project, the research group at Simon Fraser University in Vancouver, Canada, that produced the study. All over the world there has been “a huge reaction against the indiscriminate violence of [Islamist terrorist] organizations, violence which is mostly perpetrated against fellow Muslims,” he said.

Fatalities in Iraq have driven terror statistics since the U.S.-led invasion in 2003, effectively distorting global figures. When data from Iraq was excluded, researchers found no significant increase in deaths from terrorism since 2001.

“I think it’s undeniable that the trend is downwards in terms of deaths and number of conflicts,” Chris Blattman, Post-Doctoral Fellow at the Center for Global Development, said in an interview with MediaGlobal.

Nor has the trend changed.

 Decrease in acts of terrorism in 2009

The Hague - The Netherlands.

The Member States of the EU continue to be exposed to a serious threat from Islamist, ethno-nationalist and separatist, as well as from left–wing and anarchist terrorism. However, the overall number of terrorist attacks in all Member States in 2009, excluding the United Kingdom (UK), decreased by 33% compared to 2008 and is almost half of the number of attacks reported in 2007.

 

And you're welcome!

You could have had that

You could have had that effect from 12th Sept 2001 onwards, if you had wanted. And your article leaves out the crimes of the Bush-Cheney gang & successors, by the way.

Of course!  That's because

Of course!  That's because they committed no crimes, except perhaps in Momoland.  Nice deflection back to Bush!

Your reply is another GREAT example of how you deal with irrefutable facts in the face of your unsupportable assertions.  You simply deflect and change the subject to a strawman when confronted with inconvenient facts from authoritative sources.

Typical and transparent.  Your mentor would be proud.

And nobody has called to show

And nobody has called to show him mercy.

...except for Saida and the

...except for Saida and the Palestinian Marching Band.

Show me where you've seen any

Show me where you've seen any calls for mercy.

Let's ask her directly! Okay

Let's ask her directly!

Okay Saida, did Bin Laden deserve mercy?  Should the Navy SEALS have shown him mercy? 

you know what he told them?

you know what he told them? go you all are free . you know why? because our prophet mohamed (pbuh) was a very moral and honest one and tender and because of that he was able to spread islam and day by day increasing.

Hi all i am back.According to

Hi all i am back.According to some Arab s commentswhich i have read .Osama had been dead rather than been killed by Americans.They said that Americans are not stupid to kill  without interrogating him and getting information out  of him.They do not believe that his body is thrown into the sea . What do u think

I think he is on the bottom

I think he is on the bottom of the ocean feeding the fish.

The SEALS were in the compound for 40 minutes and gathered up everything useful.   There was not much more to be gained from OBL personally.  He was unlikely to say anything and the US administration no longer has the stomach for the enhanced interrogation techniques required.

On the other hand, how do you REALLY know he was buried at sea?  For all you know, he may well be in a secret cell somewhere in Alaska being interrogated by Sarah Palin.  Hmmmm.

If the American  story is

If the American  story is true , this is a good news and positive strides towards peace.Killing innocents are an  unacceptable and inhumane act.

Salaam, zawaje.As a Muslim,

Salaam, zawaje.

As a Muslim, your opinion seems to diverge from that of another Muslim posting on this thread and of a longtime European terror supporter and inveterate US hater. Also interesting to note that Pakistan's prime minister seems to agree with Obama about OBL's fate:

Bin Laden’s death, [Prime Minister Yousaf Raza] Gillani said, was “justice indeed.”

Henry _hart  as a Muslim who

Henry _hart  as a Muslim who believes that God is just.He calls for saying the truth against my self, my parents.I will  never accept or agree that no man  on the basis of his belief, sex and race  should   be scared, terrorised , being mocked .We should  treat others with respect .Forgive who wrongs you, give who deprives you, and visit who abandons you. This what i believe in.

Scholars never agree with osama way because one should not go against his rulers, moreover, fighting should be with their consents.


Henry hartThe evidence that

Henry hart

The evidence that muslims do not agree with Qaida s killing of innocent civilians is the revolution that takes place in the Arab world.None of the protestors have raised arms against their rulers.They call for economic , social and political  reforms peacefully.They voice their disapproval of corruption and injustice either by carrying banners or just by saying  to their officials. leave u office or go away.

The evidence that muslims do

The evidence that muslims do not agree with Qaida s killing of innocent civilians is the revolution that takes place in the Arab world.None of the protestors have raised arms against their rulers.They call for economic , social and political  reforms peacefully.

That is very encouraging and like Henry points out, represents a much different Arab perspective from what we've been getting.  Well done.

I tend to agree. If a person

I tend to agree. If a person wrongs me, I strive to forgive them. However, I would never presume to tell others how they should react. I would never presume, for instance, to tell a spouse or child or family member of a victim of Osama bin Laden and his murderous organization how they should respond to the well-executed military operation that ended in OBL's killing.

I find it curious that the posters I mentioned on this thread have little or no  empathy for bin Laden's victims, both past and future, and yet so much concern for the niceties accorded (or not) to a mass murderer and terrorist. Visceral hatred for the U.S., its citizens and, in particular, its troops battling terrorists around the world (as well as concurrent tolerance for, if not outright support of, terrorism) is concealed behind their hypocritical mewling for "justice" and respect for Muslim burial rituals -- as if bin Laden was worthy of, or ever showed concern for, such things for the thousands he killed.

This type of vile hatred is hardly new, of course. What's somewhat aggravating is the refusal of said posters to acknowledge it. In feigning higher motivations, they show themselves to be deceitful and insult the intelligence of the rest of us, who plainly see their venom for what it is.

 its troops battling

 its troops battling terrorists around the world HH

How can troops 'battle terrorists'? Terrorist incidents do not occur on the battlefield. Witness9/11 and 7/7. In any case the war, as it is metaphorically called, has greatly increased terrorism.  

In asymmetric warfare, the

In asymmetric warfare, the battlefield is everywhere and anywhere.  And Henry already dispatched your "increased terrorism" canard.  But I do give you points for persistence.

In asymmetric warfare, the

In asymmetric warfare, the battlefield is everywhere and anywhere.IM

This notion may enable you to enjoy fantasies of shooting enemies everywhere and anywhere but counting terrorist incidents involves using a definition somewhat more precise than that. Try the US State Department. You'll also get a clue as to the number of dead since the War on Terror was launched.

You're clearly a kind man,

You're clearly a kind man, Mike. Persistence is a nice word. My sense of eric is that he is an idiot savant. Unfortunately for him, and us, his genius skill does not seem to be amazing musical talent or the ability to instantaneously perform complex mathematical calculations, but rather his astounding ability to contort himself into moral dilemmas,  amazing feats of mental gymnastics that allow him to support terrorists and disavow democratic freedoms, and the rather mundane and annoying ability to post the same things over and over again. In this last capacity, he calls to mind Dustin Hoffman’s “Rainman” character and his continued cries to be allowed to drive the car slow in the driveway.

Since neither of our American

Since neither of our American 'patriots' deals in facts but in vilification and fantasy respectively, here as some numbers from the US State Department.  

 Afghanistan 2005-2009 People killed, injured, or kidnapped as a result of terrorism 1,557 3,532 4,657 5,430 7,584

 Iraq 2005-2009 People killed, injured, or kidnapped as a result of terrorism 20,629 38,878 44,012 19,077 16,869

He's so precious! He calls us

He's so precious! He calls us 'patriots' as if he thinks it's an insult.

Remember, eric -- slow in the driveway. Slow in the driveway.

henry eric gave you

henry eric gave you statistics , i think Americans like statistics only to proove their ideas. statistics are for the smart one, but it seems you want us to bleive that your country become the reverse and no more depends on facts. It depends only on how much money and power could USA got from the world.

Eric, I refer you back to the

Eric,

I refer you back to the link I posted above and in particular, the following quote:

Fatalities in Iraq have driven terror statistics since the U.S.-led invasion in 2003, effectively distorting global figures. When data from Iraq was excluded, researchers found no significant increase in deaths from terrorism since 2001.

 In asymmetric warfare, the battlefield is everywhere and anywhere.IM

"This notion may enable you to enjoy fantasies of shooting enemies everywhere and anywhere..."

This is not fantasy; this is reality.  The battlespace has been defined by the terrorists initiating the attack as you acknowledge yourself by using 9/11 and 7/7 as examples.  

It's very easy for you to criticize what you are unwilling to try and understand.  Would it be helpful if I post some links on asymmetric warfare for you to better understand?  Then we can have a more productive discussion on  the relative merits of specific tactics in asymmetric warfare.  

Fatalities in Iraq have

Fatalities in Iraq have driven terror statistics since the U.S.-led invasion in 2003, effectively distorting global figures.

Er, “distorting” figures? Why don’t Iraqis count? What would you say if someone else says fatalities in public transport in industrialised countries only distort the figures?

This is not fantasy; this is reality.  The battlespace has been defined by the terrorists initiating the attack as you acknowledge yourself by using 9/11 and 7/7 as examples

You are fantasising. All terrorism Bin Laden ever was accused of happened far earlier than these two attacks, which you call “initiating”. And far earlier than the invention of the “wot” by the Bush administration. But much later than US American and European installing of dictatorships in the Arab world.

Would it be helpful if I post some links on asymmetric warfare for you to better understand? 

News from my cat: it happily chased what it considered a fly, and was stung by the bee. That’s asymmetric warfare.

All terrorism Bin Laden ever

All terrorism Bin Laden ever was accused of happened far earlier than these two attacks,

No.  That is what he was indicted for, not the some total of what he is accused of doing or even what he has admitted doing, which is far more. 

Er, “distorting” figures? Why don’t Iraqis count? What would you say if someone else says fatalities in public transport in industrialised countries only distort the figures?

It's a distortion because a surge of terror fatalities in an individual country cannot be generalized into a global conclusion about a rise in terrorism, especially if the sample country is embroiled in guerilla warfare.

For instance, if there is a 1000% increase in public transport fatalities in the UK because of defective buses, it would be fallacious to generalize to a larger population and infer an increased worldwide problem in public transport, unless they are perhaps all buying the same brand of UK buses.

Statistics never tell the whole story.  You have to be able to critically interpret them (sample size, relevance, representative, etc.) before making generalized conclusions of trends or causality.  It's pretty basic stuff.

News from my dog.  She just returned from Frankfurt where she killed your cat and dropped a turd on your living room floor.  That's asymmetric warfare.

the sample country is

the sample country is embroiled in guerilla warfare

Quite coincidentally you mean, and without connection to your war, I suppose. To remind you, you disputed that it was your wars and the abolition of lawfulness which created and increased terrorism.

Statistics never tell the whole story.  You have to be able to critically interpret them

It’s my turn now to show some restraint in my reply.

No.  That is what he was indicted for, not the some total of what he is accused of doing or even what he has admitted doing, which is far more

What he bragged about would have been a reason for an investigation, but bragging is no evidence. You say he was accused of more crimes than the FBI wanted him for. By whom?

I note that you are incapable of training your dog properly. Lucky that neither my cat nor my living room are in Frankfurt.

Quite coincidentally you

Quite coincidentally you mean, and without connection to your war, I suppose. To remind you, you disputed that it was your wars and the abolition of lawfulness which created and increased terrorism.

To remind you, this was about proving an assertion of increased global terrorism and the fact that a localized sample cannot be generalized into a  global conclusion.  All the rest of your reponse is typical chaff.

What he bragged about would have been a reason for an investigation, but bragging is no evidence.

It was not bragging; it was claiming responsibility.  Admission of responsibility is indeed evidence. 

Lucky that neither my cat nor my living room are in Frankfurt.

Neither apparently is your intellect.  My dog is exceptionally well trained since she did exactly as I ordered, including the steaming deposit on your living room floor.  If a terrorist or my dog attacks in your home, then your living room is the battlespace whether you like it or agree with it or not.  You do not control the terrorist or canine tactics, weapons, or motive.  You can deter, detect, defend and destroy or you can be destroyed.  Your choice.

Likewise, since I am gving orders to my dog and have publically accepted responsibility for the attack (AKA, "evidence of responsibility"), I have no choice but to accept that you may choose to bring the fight back to me in a retalitory strike.

My guess is that it's more likely you would start a new self-pitying thread and appeal to the UN.

Neither apparently is your

Neither apparently is your intellect.

Right, my intellect is not in Frankfurt either, where an irrational terrorist sent his cur to. It’s here. I know that our resident right-wingers are capable of random brutality, and against that luck and cats’ claws help. Other sorts of terrorists—the ones who have a score to settle—don’t target me or my cat or my carpet, because I am never unjust. There is no score to settle with me via my carpet or my cat.

Other sorts of terrorists—the

Other sorts of terrorists—the ones who have a score to settle—don’t target me or my cat or my carpet, because I am never unjust. There is no score to settle with me via my carpet or my cat.

Except you don't get the choice of determining my motives.  As the canine terrorist leader, I've already determined that you are completely unjust, your cat prefers death, and your carpet is made of petro-products that unjustly contribute to global warming.  It does not matter whether YOU think you are unjust.  It only matters that the aggressor decides you are unjust.

Welcome to asymmetric warfare! 

The Canine Liberation Front (CLF) has declared war on all pet-owning hausfraus and targeting you first, regardless of your protests of innocence. 

That’s why I called you an

That’s why I called you an irrational terrorist (well, your posts are another reason to call you irrational). We must simply accept that there is always a risk. Crime will never be eliminated.

As I said (but you were unable to grasp): it’s a matter of luck, and of possessing a cat whose claws make every dog flee.

In other words: policing and jail is the right thing against terrorists. And a policy that is just.

No warfare, neither symmetric nor asymmetric. Just a nice little cell for the leader of the flat canine idiot movement, or what was its name.

"No warfare, neither

"No warfare, neither symmetric nor asymmetric. Just a nice little cell..."

Ah...but you do not get to choose MY tactics or weapons and your police have no jurisdiction for arrest.  Good luck with that warrant!  My government recognizes me as an oppressed minority and refuses extradiction.  CLF attacks will continue until you release all political prisoners in your animal shelters.

As long as you stay oppressed

As long as you stay oppressed where you are a minority, you can’t do me harm. If you come here, I’ll get you. You are definitely overrating your cur’s dangerousness.

As long as you stay oppressed

As long as you stay oppressed where you are a minority, you can’t do me harm. If you come here, I’ll get you.

I have sent my canine followers and will continue to do so.  The more you ridicule my followers, the more committed they become.  I can remain an oppressed minority, strap a bomb on my dog and turn your cat into kitty litter.  The choice of battlespace is mine as is the choice to wage war and who I wage it against.  If you capture my canines, I'll send more.  I have an endless supply.

It's very revealing that you choose to ridicule your enemy rather than engage in dialogue to understand why I and my followers have declared war.  Hmmm.   Is that your tactic with all terrorists?  How about I up the ante and set off a WMD in Berlin?  Can you hear me now?

Or are you oblivious to the point.  Asymmetric warfare involves non-state actors in unconventional battlespaces. Ignoring, ridiculing, or jailing its proponents will not stop them.  Nor will it make it less of a war.

I have an endless supply No,

I have an endless supply

No, you have not. You have oppressive aims, not I. You depend on dogs feeling helpless against injustice. Since I am for justice and equality, you are the only oppressor. That robs you of recruitment opportunities. Your supply of dogs depends on having an oppressor around who is worse than you, or perceived as worse than you. It also depends on the dogs not having an option to liberate themselves: you didn’t reckon with the dog spring. You believe your fight can only end in victory or defeat, but in reality there is a more fatal option: you will be widely ignored.

I note that your dogs love to be seen as strong, heroical, and dangerous warriors. They need that because they can’t put up with the reality of their helplessness and the immorality of their actions. Only an idiot or someone with even more sinister motives would paint them as strong, heroical, and dangerous warriors. Ridiculing them is far more to the point. Efficient too: there are pathetic curs in Frankfurt and Berlin, but nowhere near me.

The main difference between us is that you are in favour of meeting an enemy on his terrain: If your enemy is brutal and inhumane, you feel entitled to brutality and inhumanity as well (and this is false), and you think this is effective (which is false too). You are losing the basis of respect from others and your self-respect this way. Your enemy knows that, and it is his aim.

You have oppressive aims, not

You have oppressive aims, not I.

In your opinion, not mine.  Opression is in the eye of those who feel oppressed, not in your determination of who is actually oppressed.

You depend on dogs feeling helpless against injustice.

True.  Just like Al Queda and Hamas and all terrorist organizations.  But as we see above, "feelings" are a subjective reality.

Your supply of dogs depends on having an oppressor around who is worse than you, or perceived as worse than you.

Very true.  So what?  Has Al Queda run out of martyrs?  Not hardly.  In fact, Islamist terror plotters were arrested in NY today.

I note that your dogs love to be seen as strong, heroical, and dangerous warriors. They need that because they can’t put up with the reality of their helplessness and the immorality of their actions. Only an idiot or someone with even more sinister motives would paint them as strong, heroical, and dangerous warriors. Ridiculing them is far more to the point. Efficient too: there are pathetic curs in Frankfurt and Berlin..."

YES!  Excellent description of Al Queda and Hamas, although Saida might take exception of your descriptions of her Palestinian warriors as iidiots.   Well done.

"...but nowhere near me. "

Yet.  But feel free to maintain your Momostrich point of view.

The main difference between us is that you are in favour of meeting an enemy on his terrain:

Not at all.  The main difference between us that I recognize that reality--my ability to influence what terrain I meet the enemy upon is largely not of my choosing if he is the aggressor.  It means that I do not get to choose what enemies wage war against me or whether they are state or non-state actors.  That does not mean I am constrained to his tactics as you are suggesting.  But it does mean the battlespace is not largely not within my control if my posture is purely defensive.

You are losing the basis of respect from others and your self-respect this way.

I do not lose the respect of those who share my values, the citizens whom I have sworn to protect from those sworn to their subjugation or destruction.

In your opinion, not

In your opinion, not mine.

You underrate your target audience. See the Arab spring: the revolutionaries know who supported their dictators, and still support the dictatorships, and they have always known it. What’s new is that they have creative means to react, which makes the destructive ones very unattractive.

YES!  Excellent description of Al Queda and Hamas, although Saida might take exception of your descriptions of her Palestinian warriors as iidiots

Re-read, Mike. You are on the wrong track. It’s not that difficult to get.

I am amazed how quickly your two roles (dog terrorist and US terrorist) merge. Do you notice it at all?

I do not lose the respect of those who share my values

No, as long as they share your values you won’t.

I am amazed how quickly your

I am amazed how quickly your two roles (dog terrorist and US terrorist) merge. Do you notice it at all?

I attempted to illustrate specific concepts of asymmetric warfare employing a model.  But models should never be confused with that which they are modeling; they are not the same.  It's simply a means to explore a concept.  Do you notice at all?

Difficult communication, but

Difficult communication, but not that difficult. Yes. Do you?

OBL is dead and so is the

OBL is dead and so is the horse we've been flogging.

What he bragged about would

What he bragged about would have been a reason for an investigation, but bragging is no evidence. You say he was accused of more crimes than the FBI wanted him for. By whom?

Are you really that obtuse? 

The primary responsibility falls upon the hijackers. As the media covered the 9/11 attacks unfolding, many quickly speculated that Osama bin Laden was behind the attacks.[20] On the day of the attacks, the National Security Agency intercepted communications that pointed to Osama bin Laden,[21] as did German intelligence agencies.[22] This helped rule out other immediate suspects, such as Croatian nationalists, who had bombed Grand Central Terminal on September 11, 1976.[23]

Authorities in the United States and Britain also obtained electronic intercepts, including telephone conversations and electronic bank transfers, which indicate that Mohammed Atef, a bin Laden deputy, was a key figure in the planning of the 9/11 attacks. Intercepts were also obtained that revealed conversations that took place days before September 11 between bin Laden and an associate in Pakistan. In those conversations, the two referred to "an incident that would take place in America on, or around, September 11" and they discussed potential repercussions. In another conversation with an associate in Afghanistan, bin Laden discussed the "scale and effects of a forthcoming operation." These conversations did not specifically mention the World Trade Center or Pentagon, or other specifics.[24]

The investigators were quickly able to link the 19 men to the terrorist organization al-Qaeda, also by accessing material in their intelligence agency files. The New York Times reported on September 12 that: "Authorities said they had also identified accomplices in several cities who had helped plan and execute Tuesday’s attacks. Officials said they knew who these people were and important biographical details about many of them. They prepared biographies of each identified member of the hijack teams, and began tracing the recent movements of the men." FBI agents in Florida investigating the hijackers quickly "descended on flight schools, neighborhoods and restaurants in pursuit of leads." At one flight school, "students said investigators were there within hours of Tuesday’s attacks."[25] The Washington Post later reported that "In the hours after Tuesday’s bombings, investigators searched their files on [Satam] al-Suqami and [Ahmed] al-Ghamdi, noted the pair’s ties to [Nabil] al-Marabh and launched a hunt for him."[26]

Based on the evidence, authorities in the United States quickly asserted that Osama bin Laden and his al-Qaeda organization were solely responsible for the attacks, and other suspects were ruled out. The Government of the United Kingdom reached the same conclusion.[27] Although he denied the attacks at first, Osama bin Laden has since claimed full responsibility.

The short answer, Mike, is

The short answer, Mike, is yes, she is.

The more interesting question is whether her obtuseness is deliberate. It's hard to fathom how someone can legitimately spend so much time and energy bemoaning so-called rights violations against a dead terrorist mass murderer and wailing over whether his remains were properly washed, wrapped and babbled over before he was deep-sixed.

More telling is the constant anti-US rhetoric. One senses that even the killing of bin Laden -- recognized pretty much the world over as a necessary thing, if not an actual good thing -- becomes only another arrow in her bottomless quiver of hate and vitriol against all things American.

 

 

your posts remind me of

your posts remind me of something that's lying on the carpet of a Frankfurt bankster.

Whatever that is ...And no,

Whatever that is ...

And no, the earthy stench you detect wafts from your posts, not ours. And it's not a dog, but more a large, horned, bovine critter, capable of delivering loads more crap.

Wikipedia, how nice. Have you

Wikipedia, how nice. Have you got nothing better?

OBL was wanted for other crimes, not for 9/11. The public rhetoric links him to this crime. Why this discrepancy?

I would have been very curious to hear the truth in his trial.

OBL was wanted for other

OBL was wanted for other crimes, not for 9/11.

"Wanted" can mean more than a criminal court context.  You just refuse to acknowledge that reality because you disagree with it.  Hmmm...new animal...the Momostrich? 

I would have been very curious to hear the truth in his trial.

Me too, but I'm content with the second best option we received.

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