Quote of the day

Economic inequality is, in substantial part, a political phenomenon

Syndicate content

Login

Login or Register to be identified in your comments

Signpost Blog

Email & RSS

Sign up to oD's editorial summaries email:



Follow oD on Twitter:


Join our Facebook group:
Add oD to your Netvibes: Add to Netvibes

openDemocracy likes:

Navigation

ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF THE MUSLIMS


Posts:


ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF THE MUSLIMS There have been numerous comments about the futility or undesirability of population growth. For example From freedem: As to breeding as a method of conquest, only the net long term breeding counts and then it doesn't count for very much. Muslims are very far from thinking of world conquest, or any conquest except possibly to recapture land taken from them. They just want to defend themselves from harmful Western intrusions. From M_7:


Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.


Posts:


Re: ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF TH
I think the flaw in the argument is in the assumption that Islam is something better (or even different) from other religions. Like most other religions, it is simply a set of beliefs that can be taken up and discarded at will, even if this can take generations. Taken in conjunction with education I would expect such beliefs to be tempered with reason. My guess is that the growth of Islam will reverse as people become educated and so will be self limiting. I can't see many places in the world accepting dictats from a bunch of right wing clerics. I don't even think that this will last long in Iran and may well have changed already except for the political machinations of Ahmajinedad and some unintended "help" from the west. You may argue that this is not what Islam is about, and you may be right, but it is how many see it from both insde and outside Islam. One of Islam's strengths, as seen by yourself, I think, is that it allows for people to decide for themselves in its interpretation - it is between you and your God. But this is not how many others see it; many would prefer it to impose strict rules, not only upon themselves, but also on others. I expect there are many other shades also and in this it is little different from Christianity. In Christianity the power of the Pope to dictate to large numbers of people has diminished over the years, and rightly so. Time has long passed when most people, even catholics, actually believe the Pope to be God's representative on earth and for him to be right on every issue. At present Islam is enjoying a position where it can be all things to all men and many of its members are happy not to look too hard at the differences. The religion does not seem able to stop the Sunni and Shia factions killing each other even though, to western eyes the differences are subtle. It does not stop many liberal muslims being imprisoned in Iran for disagreeing with the Mullahs or for a person in Afghanistan being threatened with execution for simply changing his religion from being a Muslim. There are a large number of people who agree with such positions within Islam and those who would wish the imposition of Sharia law in the world. These people are not going to accept any watering down of their view of Islam because it offends the sensibilities of moderates. In their view the infidels can be destroyed. I know this is an exteme view of Islam but it is present and prominent. I think the seeds of destruction are already visible.



Posts:


Re: ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF TH
englishman, This posting is not acomparative analysis about which religion is better or about tensiona and disagreements within Iislam. it just addresses the question of the impact of the population parameter on history. You do raise some interesting questions. I will try to address them soon, but first I should work on examples of the often decisive influence of population. In the meantime, you wrote: "I think the flaw in the argument is in the assumption that Islam is something better (or even different) from other religions." You know I have come to respect your opinion, but in this case that sentence is not direcly related to the question at hand. Two points: First, many hundreds of millions of Muslims believe Islam is far beter, though Christianity and Judaism have merit. They will not be swayed by your arguments, especially if they sound a little agnostic. Second, the question of population as a "bastion" does not relate to who or what is better than whom.



Posts:


Re: ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF TH
By "better" or "different" in comparison with other religions, I was referring to an implied assumption that Islam will retain influence as populations become better educated. As this happens, there has usually been a decline in the power of religion to have a dominant influence on people's behaviour, even if the people still claim to belong to that religion. The essence of the discussion was that Islam is growing in the world (which it is) and that education is an important part of Islamic culture. I was pointing out that this will ultimately self limit the growth of Islam in the same way it has limited, and reversed, the growth of Christianity. The demographics are 33% claim to be Christian, 21% Islam, 16% non-religious and 14% Hindu. (I should point out the pie chart I got this info from, and widely published on the web, has its sum of percentages as greater than 100%). Interestingly the world population is set to rise from 6.5B today to about 9B by 2050 but the main growth is from increasing longevity rather than increasing birthrates. This may not be especially relevant but is interesting nonetheless.



Posts:


Re: ONLY ON OPENDEMOCRACY: EXPOSING THE SECRET MASTER PLAN OF TH
OK, englishman, now I understand more clearly what you meant, and I agree. The idea is that by the time population begins to level off, it should be as large as possible. I have seen estimates of the world's Muslim population: 20% from those who are hostile to Muslims, perhaps due to an ongoing conflict or some other reason. 23.5% from what appear to be neutral and aloof sources. 26% from Muslim some sources. So much for objectivity.