
A major new series from Imprint Academic on the use of randomisation in education, politics and other public policy areas. Special discount prices for OurKingdom and openDemocracy readers.
Part of the openDemocracy Network
Sortition and public policyLabour After BrownFrom Milibland to Johnson land?: Jeremy Gilbert argues for Labour without neo-liberalism. Magical thinking on Britishness: Anthony Barnett critiques Liam Byrne on fraternity. Rule of law at risk: Geoffrey Bindman calls for a turn away from the marketisation of government. A new Bill of Rights for Britain?: Guy Aitchison analyses Parliament's proposed new Bill of Rights. Miliband - by our rights we will know you: Claire O'Brien puts forward a new progressive vision for Labour. NOT A DAY LONGER
England Awakes?England, Britain and multiculturalism: an OurKingdom exchange A mild awakening?, England's turn? by David Goodhart OurKingdom TagsNavigation |
Can you have the good without the bad?Peter Facey (London, Unlock Democracy): There has been lots of discussion on this blog about nationalism, patriotism, identity and even how the centre left should become more nationalist. I have always been interested in identity, nations and nationalism. I have a strong personal identity and am attracted to the way nation or community identity can bind people together across economic and religious divides. You only have to look at the impact of Wales winning the Six Nations on the mood of the nation or England’s winning of the Ashes in 2005 to see how nationalism in the sporting arena can bind people together. Hopefully this summer will see the British Olympics Team doing well and the whole country (or at least the large part that is interested in sport) come together and celebrate. However, there is a darker side that has always stopped me from considering myself a nationalist of any sort in the political sense. I am not talking here about forms of extreme nationalism such as Fascism or National Socialism. My qualm is with the apparent requirement to put the interest of the nation ahead of anything or anyone else and to see anyone else who challenges the nation (or their definition of it) as a threat. In a country like Sweden or Australia where there are no competing identities or nationalisms these may be a minor setback. But in country where there are competing national identities - British, Scottish, Irish, Ulster, Welsh and Cornish - it is a serious problem. Most nationalists seem to require loyalty or at least primacy to one nation. On the web this seems to be worse where it seems to require people to put down others who aren't part of that nation or who don’t conform. So someone like me who has described himself as English but said I don’t support a English Parliament gets accused of being anti-English. The English Democrats made the extraordinary claim in their London election broadcast earlier this month that the sum contribution Scotland has made to the world is "Irn Bru and deep fried Mars Bars" - a claim that is as pig ignorant as it is offensive. Over the years I've heard plenty of Scottish nationalists give as good as they get. This isn’t just a big nation phenomenon. It can even be seen by some comments by Cornish nationalists talking about local identities in England as being “mere counties”. While the SNP and Plaid Cymru continue to make claims from time to time which seem calculated to wind up anyone with English or British inclinations, their electoral success in recent years has gone hand in hand with self-conscious efforts to moderate their language. So my question to the nationalist community is this: does nationalism have to be focused so much on developing a sense of grievance and "them versus us"? And not from where I'm sitting either. Glasgow. Personally I used to see a common purpose in the UK, but that has faded quite a bit for me over the last twenty years or so. I can quite understand the concern of English folk that there is a democratic deficit, because let's face it, there is. But, it seems to me that what we have at the moment is a transition mechanism towards full Scottish Independence, certainly not 'the settled will of the people'. I see no advantage in nationalism which sees itself as measured by a sense of grievance. But neither do I see maintenance of the status quo as viable. We are like people who are no longer happy to live together, trying to find the killer reason for splitting up. Which usually turns out to be something trivial.
"While the SNP... continue to make claims from time to time which seem calculated to wind up anyone with English or British inclinations" How about some links or references Peter? That statement sounds like the parroting of received wisdom to me. Nationalism is a serious problem in Britain because the constitution does not adequately reflect the identities of the people of the United Kingdom. In England 'English' has overtaken 'British' as the primary identity, yet when it comes to politics Britain has primacy over England (for all intents and purposes England doesn't even exist). Give England, Wales and Scotland primacy over Britain and I can't see a problem. Very good point Peter and personally I like to think in terms of solidarity between people but also peoples, however first things first. When the Cornish national identity is treated with equality and a serrious debate on devolution engaged then we can talk about the point you've raised. Gareth, And of course give Cornwall primacy over England and therefore Britain. Its interesting with the Duchy of Cornwall we actually had a constitutional settlement that recognised the Cornish but it's been moth balled. http://thecornishdemocrat.blogspot.com/ This is a response from Mike Knowles, posted on his behalf: 'Peter Facey of Unlock Democracy hesitates to declare for England. I sat with him before the Justice Committee of MPs holding an inquiry into 'Devolution a Decade on' (the outcome of which was known from when it started. It will propose the diviision of England into regions each with their regional assembly. That is the policy supported by the Committee's Chairman Mr Alan Beith MP, as he made known on March 8th at the Lib Dem Spring Conference in L'Pool while the Committee was still taking evidence. It will do that despite the fact that Professor Robert Hazell, Director of the Constitution Unit, informed it in the course of his evidence on November 14th of last year that 'the only adequate solution to the English Question is an English Parliament'.). Peter Facey in his evidence to the Committee Feb.19th stated he considered himself English but did not support an English Parliament. Reading his most recent contribution to this blog, what comes across is that he is very typical of the political 'class' in England, to which he belongs, which George Orwell so neatly characterised -able to find every reason imaginable not to commit to England. It just is not the done thing. For me Lady MacBeth's description of her husband in Act 1 Sc V11 serves the same purpose best. Macbeth wanted the crown but could find it in himself to do what she considered the only way to get it -by killing Duncan. Macbeth was 'letting I dare not wait upon I would like the poor cat in the adage' . The adage she was refering to was that of the cat eyeing the fish in the goldfish bowl but not wanting to get its feet wet. Post new comment |
Just Posted
Just Commented
Email AlertsFill in the form below to sign up to our automatic daily alerts, or weekly editorial summary (you will be taken to another page to confirm which options you want).
OK is reading
They say about OK"the ever-stimulating OpenDemocracy"
Ekklesia "See OurKingdom to keep up" South Belfast Diary "...an essential guide to understanding the dynamic constitutional situation..." Peter Oborne "...becoming a daily read for me." Iain Dale "To make sense of it all, check out OurKingdom..." Matthew d'Ancona "Worth a look...it is, however, recommended by Matthew d'Ancona." The Wardman Wire "Fast becoming the best political website around" Tom Waterhouse, CEP "...attracting energy from a range of contributors." thenextwave "...looks very promising..." The England Project "The excellent new OurKingdom blog from OpenDemocracy..." The Green Ribbon "On the internet, I keep in touch with openDemocracy, a website on global current affairs, and its useful offshoot, OurKingdom" Andreas Whittam-Smith "thanks to the fine folk at OurKingdom, (who manage to communicate a variety of perspectives in the way that only a decent group blog can)" Nostalgia For the Future |
Wyrdtimes said:
Wed, 2008-05-14 09:41"So my question to the nationalist community is this: does nationalism
have to be focused so much on developing a sense of grievance and "them
versus us"?"
Not from where I'm sitting anyway. In fact as far as I'm concerned it's not
about them at all it it’s about US - those people who have chosen to live in England.
I don't agree with the way some English Democrats are always banging on
about Scotland. There is however a legitimate sense of grievance - why is a Scot worth so many
more £££ from the British Government than an English person, and the obvious democratic deficit. It’s fair and right to flag these issues up.
But to me English nationalism is about making all England better. Not at the expense or detriment to any other nation. I believe an independent England will not only be much better for us here in England but would also be good for the rest of the world too, and especially good for our relations with our closest neighbours.
Regarding the British, Scottish, Irish, Ulster, Welsh choosing to live in England I put it to them that they are in fact choosing to be – English.
IMO the English Democrats should stop pussyfooting around the Union issue and come out in favour of independence – it’s a far more positive and persuasive argument than the current cock up or some botched federal solution.
English taxes for England
English law for England
Home rule for England